Politics Thread

[boozehound]

Your post is a good example of liberal narrative fantasy. We all know the White House press release was wrong. No one is claiming Covid is over, not even the WH, who now says the release was "poorly worded". It was a stupid sloppily written press release, but now you want to argue, "SEE, SEE!! Conservatives think Covid has ended!!!"

The mental gymnastics that you guys have to do to support Trump kills me. Trump does nothing but push a narrative based in fantasy. He is the best at everything. His crowds are always the largest ever. COVID is going to go away - in fact, It's almost gone. That's just a few, without getting into some of the wackier stuff that he has retweeted or referenced.

But, the biggest fantasy of all is the ruse that this is somehow a competent administration. Hell - the logic you just used was that it was a stupid sloppily written press release. We are in year 4 of this administration and they can't proofread a press release? They were supposed to be the best at everything! They weren't career politicians - they are business people.

I get it: Trump gets the benefit of the doubt 100% of the time.

"Sure Trump is inexperienced, but he will surround himself with the best and most qualified people. See! Look at James Mattis!"
"James Mattis is just butthurt because Trump fired him. He is lying. Also he might be a Democrat, but we aren't sure"

There is literally no limit to what you can't justify if you just allow yourself to slip into that sweet, sweet fantasy world.

[boozehound]

I think Trump is grossly unqualified and that as the senate majority leader Mitch McConnell acted in a way that was totally unprecedented in American history in order to push his own agenda. I'm not just talking about the Supreme Court, but the over 100 judicial nominations to the district courts and the court of appeals that were made by Obama and that were never called to a vote, and the over 450 pieces of legislation that passed through the House but were never called for a vote. No one has done that, ever. And I think that if the Dems go for the sweep (which they have a good chance of doing) that unprecedented act will receive an unprecedented response.

But, while xenophobes, racists, and homophobes will probably vote Republican, I also don't think that's representative of most Republicans. The lunatics who actually do want to overthrow the country (or some variation of that) will likely vote Democrat, but that's not representative most Democrats.

In short, and I say this from someone who is kind of in the middle here, both sides are actually kinda fucked up and we'd all be better off if they'd actually do more to shout down the lunatic fringe that exists in both their camps.

100% agree.

I don't really think Trump is particularly racist or sexist, however I also don't think that the fact that he appointed a female to the Supreme Court or passed a piece of legislature disqualifies him from being racist or sexist. It sounds like the "I can't be racist, I have a black friend" argument. I do think Trump is wholly transactional. If racist groups support him, he will play to them. If xenophobes support him, he will play to it. He does that because he has no actual principles, other than he is the best and anything he decides at a given moment is true. I believe it was John Kelly who referred to him as "the most flawed human being he has ever met". That's probably about right. I can only imagine that shit that guy saw.

[paulxu]

The White House science office lists "ending the Covid-19 pandemic" as one of the top accomplishments of the Trump administration's first term despite the fact that new coronavirus cases are rising precipitously throughout the country, resulting in many hospitals nationwide approaching maximum capacity.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/tommybe.../#4ceec57b1034

They need more proof readers at the White House.

[bobbiemcgee]

Kushner: Trump had to take the country 'back from the doctors'

"In newly released audio, President Trump's senior adviser and son-in-law Jared Kushner told journalist Bob Woodward in mid-April that Trump had cut out the doctors and scientists advising him on the unfolding Covid-19 pandemic."

This is what happens when you appoint a spoiled little rich kid as a Sr. Advisor. Coupled with trump saying the Doctors were ripping off the public with covid treatments, i don't think they'll be getting a lot of votes from the medical community.

[Strange Brew]

Just voted today. Sorry Bobbie, I likely balanced out your vote.

[Muskie in dayton]

That these types of people recognize their party has been taken over by the Trump racism, xenophobia, homophobia and misogyny...and they are trying to reach real conservatives for a re-making of their party, actually gives me some hope for the future of the country.

Huh, interesting. The reason I’ve gravitated toward the Republican Party is because the Democrats have become completely intolerant of other beliefs. There’s also an element of anti-gay and anti-Semitic. Maybe I need some more mainstream media brainwashing.

[bobbiemcgee]

Just voted today. Sorry Bobbie, I likely balanced out your vote.

Don't think we will have to worry about that in CO. Besides, my whole family voted blue.

[XU 87]

The mental gymnastics that you guys have to do to support Trump kills me. Trump does nothing but push a narrative based in fantasy. He is the best at everything. His crowds are always the largest ever. COVID is going to go away - in fact, It's almost gone. That's just a few, without getting into some of the wackier stuff that he has retweeted or referenced.

But, the biggest fantasy of all is the ruse that this is somehow a competent administration. Hell - the logic you just used was that it was a stupid sloppily written press release. We are in year 4 of this administration and they can't proofread a press release? They were supposed to be the best at everything! They weren't career politicians - they are business people.

I get it: Trump gets the benefit of the doubt 100% of the time.

"Sure Trump is inexperienced, but he will surround himself with the best and most qualified people. See! Look at James Mattis!"
"James Mattis is just butthurt because Trump fired him. He is lying. Also he might be a Democrat, but we aren't sure"

There is literally no limit to what you can't justify if you just allow yourself to slip into that sweet, sweet fantasy world.

Now where did I say I was supporting Trump's supposed "claim" that Covid was over? Again, more fantasy from you. In fact, I don't particularly like Trump. My point is that you liberals are incapable of engaging in fact based discussion. You have your narratives based on fiction, and anyone who disagrees with you is declared a racist or homophobe or some other name. Paul said as much. And you agree with him.

[paulxu]

I'm confused about why my narratives are based on fiction.
They're based on Trump's words and actions. And that doesn't count the dog whistle comments.
When you put a ban on Muslim countries, and tell US Congresswomen to “go back and help fix the totally broken and crime infested places from which they came,” ..that's xenophobia.

So, let's have a "fact based" discussion. Those are facts.
My conclusion is that a person who feels that way is xenophobic.
What am I missing?

[boozehound]

Now where did I say I was supporting Trump's supposed "claim" that Covid was over? Again, more fantasy from you. In fact, I don't particularly like Trump. My point is that you liberals are incapable of engaging in fact based discussion. You have you're narratives based on fiction, and anyone who disagrees with you is declared a racist or homophobe or some other name. Paul said as much. And you agree with him.

I don't see where I agreed with Paul. In fact, I posted something right below the post that you quoted that would be considered somewhat contradictory Paul's theory. Oddly enough that didn't really get addressed. Nor were any of my other points addressed.

It's hard to have a balanced discussion with someone who is going to pick and choose individual snippets and put words in people's mouths. You claim that 'you liberals are incapable of engaging in fact based discussion' which suggests to me that you view the world through a black and white lens in which 100MM+ 'Liberals' are painted with a broad brush as 'bad'. That is a world view I can't wrap my head around.

I'm happy to engage in a substantive back and forth with anybody on this board (or anywhere else) assuming that someone seeks to actually engage in a substantive back and forth, rather than debate semantics and specific snippets of a larger argument without addressing the overall argument. To that end I'm removing myself from this conversation.