Ukraine

**bjf123** · 03-08-2022, 06:17 PM

Originally Posted by xu82

Strangely, I read that with an accent!

You’re not alone!

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**UCGRAD4X** · 03-08-2022, 08:57 PM

oui

**xubrew** · 03-10-2022, 10:32 AM

This thread is discouraging.

In regards to Trump's comments, I think it's well documented that I'm no Trump fan, but I actually didn't take that much issue with his comments. It's probably not the same choice of words I would have made, but I still thought it was just an assessment. I'll try and lighten the mood by saying that if Superman can say that Lex Luther is smart and not have anyone mistake that as some sort of praise or admiration, then I think we can do the same here.

Putin IS smart. At the very least, he is tactful when it comes to getting what he wants. He basically undertook a legislative coup, and used/changed the laws to totally insulate himself, and he now basically has unchecked power and has eliminated any real mechanism that could be used to get rid of him. Now, I DO NOT admire this man! I would be upset if anyone read that and then tried to twist that around into saying that I somehow respect him. I do not! But he is smart. His cards aren't as good as a lot of other people's, but yet he's still winning and is still doing what he wants without being checked. This is happening because he was able to manipulate himself into that situation. He didn't do that by being stupid.

I do not see a situation where Putin leaves power unless he is literally dragged out of office. Now...how does that happen?? I have no fucking idea. I do not know what to do about this, or what should be done about this. I don't even have any ideas as to what might work. I am therefore announcing that I will NOT be running for office. I would like to suggest that while I don't know what should be done, I'm pretty sure escalating our own domestic political squabbles is not the answer. But, I have no confidence at all that we will not go down that road.

**paulxu** · 03-11-2022, 11:32 AM

This is a recap today from a guy I find very realistic in his assessments. He is a historian by training, but runs the TPM blog.
Anyway, this seems like a good take on Ukraine at this point.
I wonder if we're headed to a situation like North/South Korea. Russia may take all of Ukraine, but the border becomes almost a DMZ, and Russia sinks into a pariah-like state, where their economy is shattered and they have to keep control of the media to keep their citizens in the dark under control.
Unlike North Korea, the Russian population has know the reality of a more open society and capitalism of a sorts (McDonald's and all). They may not like to become a new North Korea.

https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog/taking-stock-9

**bobbiemcgee** · 10-01-2022, 11:40 PM

Putin has backed himself in a corner. He is a friggin' madman and I think he will strongly consider tactical nukes or blowing up the Ukraine's nuclear reactors. They also have a ton of chemical weapons. Of course, as soon as the nukes or the chemicals start to roll, NATO will attack them with missiles. Meanwhile, people can't get out of Russia fast enough. This is going to get very messy.

**UCGRAD4X** · 10-02-2022, 07:55 AM

Yes. Unfortunately this is a lose-lose situation all the way around. Nobody comes out of this any better. Putin will NOT back down. His whole life and legacy as a strong-man / hard-ass is on the line. He will go down in flames for Mother Russia (and NOT for the Russians).

What a friggin' nightmare. God help us all!

xuphan · 10-02-2022, 09:01 AM

Originally Posted by UCGRAD4X

Yes. Unfortunately this is a lose-lose situation all the way around. Nobody comes out of this any better. Putin will NOT back down. His whole life and legacy as a strong-man / hard-ass is on the line. He will go down in flames for Mother Russia (and NOT for the Russians).

What a friggin' nightmare. God help us all!

So, was the invasion into Ukraine solely a Putin decision or a decision made by Putin and the Russian Oligarchs? I figured the Russian Oligarchs would pressure Putin more with their assets being freezed or taken in the west but they seem to be puppets to Putin. Surprised they are still backing this invasion.

**xudash** · 10-02-2022, 10:56 AM

Originally Posted by xuphan

So, was the invasion into Ukraine solely a Putin decision or a decision made by Putin and the Russian Oligarchs? I figured the Russian Oligarchs would pressure Putin more with their assets being freezed or taken in the west but they seem to be puppets to Putin. Surprised they are still backing this invasion.

We’ll, some of them are mostly dead, so they no longer have an opinion on the matter.

Some fascinating parallels to Hitler: he believed the German people failed and deserved their fate at the end of the war.