A-10 Xavier vs. Big East Xavier

**D-West & PO-Z** · 02-24-2021, 02:42 PM

Originally Posted by XUGRAD80

Exactly, that’s what I’ve been trying to say in other threads. X was the big fish in a pond of small fish. Now they are in with fish their own size, or even bigger. I don’t expect them to dominate these fish like they did those fish. Compete well, yes. Dominate, no. Not yet. CAN they get to a point where they are traditionally a top 3 team in the BE? Yes, I think they can. But they aren’t there yet.

In the BE the highs will be much higher (in terms of great reg seasons like 2018, not tourney which can be a crapshoot) and lows will be much higher.

**xubrew** · 02-25-2021, 11:42 AM

Thanks for putting this together!

I hated the Atlantic Ten. Probably more than I should have. But, I liked a lot of programs that were in it at the time. My main issues were with the leadership, and in hindsight looking back on it now it may not have been that big of a deal. I hated that schools like Xavier and Dayton that basically had P5 level resources were playing basketball in the same conference as Fordham, who if you took out of the A10 and placed in the MAAC or Patriot League would still finish in the bottom half of the conference more often than not. Fordham and La Salle basically never even tried, and no pressure was ever put on them to try. They just took their share of the revenue that Xavier was largely responsible for generating, and kept doing them. Yeah, was never a fan of that. I still don't understand how Fordham seemingly got bigger NCAA Tournament payouts than Xavier did. But...I don't care anymore. It's in the past now.

I hated that they axed the A10 Network, which I know wasn't really a network but more of a production company that made games available, just when streaming was becoming a thing and instead inked a TV deal that actually prevented a lot of games from getting on the air, or if they were on TV they were on high premium networks that almost no one got on their packages.

But...those Xavier A10 teams were legit. They were certainly Big East good. I don't think I have to convince anyone here of that. Some of the other schools really were too. Nothing that A10 did kept us from reaching our ceiling. Saint Joe's had some great teams. So did Temple. Dayton had underachieving teams nearly every year, but the rivalry with them was good at the time. You had to be good to win as much as Xavier did in the Atlantic Ten. Half of it was crap, but the top half of it did generate some pretty good teams.

Xavier · 02-25-2021, 12:48 PM

I know the move to the Big East is better overall for the school and athletic department. I think an argument could be made that if Sean would have stayed, Xavier would be more equipped to become a Gonzaga level by staying in the A10.

**boozehound** · 02-25-2021, 01:06 PM

Originally Posted by Xville

So I just looked at national rankings from past Xavier years....wow....so Xs 2010 recruiting class was 18 in the nation....this just goes to show how imperfect recruiting is or at least was. Here are the recruits:

Justin Martin
Jay canty
Griffin McKenzie
Jordan Latham

Yikes.

2011 x was 20... a bit better here:

Jalen Reynolds
Dez wells
Dee Davis

The 2010 class definitely goes down as one of Xavier's all-time bust classes. The 2011 class was probably a pretty good class if Dez Wells had finished his career at Xaiver.

NOVA · 02-25-2021, 06:42 PM

Was checking in to see how you guys were doing and thought this and the expectations threads were interesting. As far as expectations of a program, I think you have to take the coach out and look at the program and school. I think what’s so cool about the Big East is that every school is basketball centric, every school has some level of strong basketball pedigree and and every school has leadership that has made clear hoops is the flagship sport. So from that very pure standpoint, I think every school/program should have a realistic expectation to be able to compete for the conference every year. Now with that said, every school has its own unique strengths and weaknesses that can pit it at a further advantage or disadvantage. With X, I see the big positives being highly institutional commitment to the sport, superior arena situation, good basketball geography. Those are three huge pluses that, in my opinion , puts the expectations of top 5 in conference every year pretty realistic.

The original post regarding “expectations” focused around basketball budgets; I wouldnt get hung up on that. Marquette’s is higher because they pay fiserve arena rent. Nova is higher bc they have to make sure they pay an HOF coach a salary near the top. In general I would think that X would be prepared to pay the right coach higher salary if needed and again, I do think they have the resources to give the coach everything he would want. I don’t think any of our schools with exception of maybe UConn are going to sacrifice academics or build athlete-only dorms or things like that: I don’t think that is neccessarily needed in hoops to be successful. Yes I think some schools have larger endowments that may it them at a longer term advantage and X’s may be on the smaller side but it’s also a smaller student body so there is not as much overhead etc. I think the resources for all the schools in the conference for a sport like hoops are fine.

Final point on expectations and in my opinion, the most relevant on a year to year basis depends on the coach. I’ll use nova as an example. Jay is at such a level that we have top 10 expectations every year now and while the school and program have had consistent levels of success throughout its history, if an assistant takes over next year, those expectations will likely drastically change. When Lappas was coach, sure we had some good years but expectations were different. Not sure if Steele is the right guy or not; I don’t watch X nearly enough to form as accurate opinion like you guys can. But I will say a coach in the big East will almost always need a few years to get his systems and culture in place to compete consistently. In the A10, that may not have been as much of a need so a newer coach could win more games more quickly. So I would be patient. But I will say in my opinion, steele needs to get off the transfer hamster wheel. He’s not doing his frosh and core group any favors and they always seem like a lineup hodgepodge when I watch them. He’s recruiting well, so he should take the lumps that come with young players and watch them grow. Wright did this with his first class of foye ray sumpter and Fraser. Was frustRating for a. Kills of years but by their senior year, they were a 1 seed.

Good luck the rest of the way. No reason why X can’t be competing for the top spot on a regular basis.