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  1. #161
    Supporting Member paulxu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xudash View Post
    Totally agree.

    It was like, "hey, come over here and pin me down" instead of maintaining movement on a number of occasions.
    If EKU can press us into 27 TO's, I would imagine some BE coaches may gameplan this approach.
    ...he went up late, and I was already up there.

  2. #162
    Quote Originally Posted by paulxu View Post
    If EKU can press us into 27 TO's, I would imagine some BE coaches may gameplan this approach.
    The 27 is an anomaly... most of those were unforced or just showboating after our guys busted their pressure. Good luck to BE coaches dealing with our core 4.
    Last edited by Xuperman; 12-16-2018 at 06:30 PM.
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  3. #163
    Supporting Member muskienick's Avatar
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    1) The EKU game was one of the ugliest I've had to witness at Xavier since the Dick Campbell years.
    2) Our guards generally seemed totally unprepared to deal with a pressing defense. They actually seemed to wait to be double-teamed or often dribbled to a position on the floor where it was easier for the defense to force bad passes or trap the ball again.
    3) I could not believe that it took our coaching staff about 10 minutes to figure out that our players were incapable to defend against a very lowly-rated D-1 team in the man-to-man set. To their credit, one (or more) of them finally realized that it might be wise to go to the zone where our guys seemed to be much more comfortable and, strangely, much more willing to play aggressively. Is there some reason why we seem to be reticent to buy into being (for the most part) a solid zone defense team?
    Last edited by muskienick; 12-16-2018 at 08:05 PM.

  4. #164
    Supporting Member XUGRAD80's Avatar
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    There is an excellent article on the 24/7 site about this adapting of the zone defense, how it’s been implemented, how it frees up the outside players, why it’s working so well as it takes advantage of the physical talents of people like Q and Naji. Was compared to the zone that Syracuse uses and how it can actually generate offense off of the turnovers it creates.

    When looking at the Xavier turnovers in the game, it’s important to look at just who had them. Q only had 2 until very late in the game when he got his 3rd, and Castlin only had 1 the entire game. It was Hardin and Kennedy at the guards and Naji, Jones, and Zach that had most of the turnovers. Many of those were from those guards, and Naji, driving to far in and waiting to long to send passes to the post, after defeating the press in the backcourt. There were also some very dubious offensive fouls called that are includeded in the TO category. Very few of the turnovers actually occurred when X was in a 1/2 court set. Haven’t seen the statistic for EK points off of turnovers, but I bet it wasn’t really bad.

    One of the comments made in the 24/7 article (by Q if I remember correctly) was that in this game there were actually very few “plays” called and it was much more of a free flowing type game. Games like that usually result in many more turnovers, but they also result in many more possessions. I’d be interested to see if the % of turnovers per possession was really that much higher than some of the other games where X had many fewer turnovers, but also many fewer possessions. Also remember that X shot 71% for this game. Compare that to the UC game, or some of the others. If X hadn’t been shooting so many layups, they would never shoot that high of a percentage.

    So I guess it’s somewhat of a trade off. In a free flowing game like that, you get many more possessions, get many more layups and dunks, but also usually have many more turnovers. Unusual to have such a free flowing game when X was playing so much zone though.

  5. #165
    All-Conference XUFan09's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XUGRAD80 View Post
    There is an excellent article on the 24/7 site about this adapting of the zone defense, how it’s been implemented, how it frees up the outside players, why it’s working so well as it takes advantage of the physical talents of people like Q and Naji. Was compared to the zone that Syracuse uses and how it can actually generate offense off of the turnovers it creates.

    When looking at the Xavier turnovers in the game, it’s important to look at just who had them. Q only had 2 until very late in the game when he got his 3rd, and Castlin only had 1 the entire game. It was Hardin and Kennedy at the guards and Naji, Jones, and Zach that had most of the turnovers. Many of those were from those guards, and Naji, driving to far in and waiting to long to send passes to the post, after defeating the press in the backcourt. There were also some very dubious offensive fouls called that are includeded in the TO category. Very few of the turnovers actually occurred when X was in a 1/2 court set. Haven’t seen the statistic for EK points off of turnovers, but I bet it wasn’t really bad.

    One of the comments made in the 24/7 article (by Q if I remember correctly) was that in this game there were actually very few “plays” called and it was much more of a free flowing type game. Games like that usually result in many more turnovers, but they also result in many more possessions. I’d be interested to see if the % of turnovers per possession was really that much higher than some of the other games where X had many fewer turnovers, but also many fewer possessions. Also remember that X shot 71% for this game. Compare that to the UC game, or some of the others. If X hadn’t been shooting so many layups, they would never shoot that high of a percentage.

    So I guess it’s somewhat of a trade off. In a free flowing game like that, you get many more possessions, get many more layups and dunks, but also usually have many more turnovers. Unusual to have such a free flowing game when X was playing so much zone though.
    A lot of this is spot-on. The turnovers were part of the high-risk-high-reward playstyle that was rather free-flowing. EKU's defense was selling out on turnovers, so X played into that. The turnover rate was still bad, but it wasn't horrific because the possession count was so high. Basically, X usually scored if they didn't turn it over. In sum, they scored on 42 possessions, turned the ball over on 27 possessions, and gave up a defensive rebound on 17 possessions.

    Naji was guilty of the most individual turnovers (6), as he tries to play the point forward type. Long-term I don't mind him taking on that role, because he can make a lot of plays for himself and others, and he did at least notch 6 assists. However, there are going to be growing pains, not to mention that he needs to calm down on trying to make the home run pass.

    Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

  6. #166
    Quote Originally Posted by Xuperman View Post
    Our coach will need to grow into the job quickly and continue to pound defense first. We have a very physically gifted and talented group with great chemistry, until we see some on court friction/finger pointing or any whiff of coach losing the locker room, X will be X!!
    Last night was a steaming pile of cow dung and the seed of doubt has been planted in it. Hopefully it can be forgotten quickly or that kind of performance that can have lingering effects. This is gut check time for Steele and staff,....the first of many. If the players start to question their coaches, even subtly ala the Naji twitter thing, it could snowball into something bigger.
    Last edited by Xuperman; 12-19-2018 at 08:06 AM.
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  7. #167
    Supporting Member GoMuskies's Avatar
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    Not that early anymore assessment: we're shitty.

  8. #168
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    I am a 5 year fan but have followed college hoops for 50 years. Xavier has been spoiled recently with excellent teams, and the Kanter grad transfer almost put a nice team into the final 4 by adding one of the best offensive centers in the country into our lap for one year. What we see this year is reality and what most teams and fan bases have to deal with. The Provident/FSU one two punch probably cost us Mack, Gates and even the Bordeaux guy who has looked pretty good. Right now the team, the coaches (and more from the assistants is needed) and even the fan base must reset expectations, realize we may be playing Wed(like 2 years ago at MSG), aim for Thursday and God forbid Friday. I hope there is a players only meeting with some leadership by Q and Tyrique at least and a realization by the grad transfers that to see the big dance they must play a bigger role in play and example. Good luck X and get ready for a bumpy ride and hopefully not all lows.

  9. #169
    Supporting Member fellahmuskie's Avatar
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    When I ordered tickets to the DePaul game a few months ago, I had no idea how big it would be.

    Last year's team barely escaped twice vs. DePaul, so maybe we can start turning this around with a convincing win in Chicago. Oh, and take care of business Friday vs. Detroit.

  10. #170
    Supporting Member GoMuskies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fellahmuskie View Post
    When I ordered tickets to the DePaul game a few months ago, I had no idea how big it would be.
    It literally could decide last place in the league. Though I think Georgetown may still have something to say about that.

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