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  1. #21
    I don't think they get the death penalty, but how could they not get some major penalties based on the violations? They paid players to play there...that's like the worst thing you can do. There has to be something substantial for that - loss of schollies and post-season bans.

  2. #22
    Sophomore sirthought's Avatar
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    Isn't the bigger fear at this point for imposing the death penalty not what happens to Louisville, but if the NCAA gets sued by all the TV and Radio networks, not to mention people who own the arena and other related businesses in Louisville?

    Those third party businesses and their employees don't care if a recruit's family gets some money thrown their way. They care if their investment will pay off and if they can make their own payroll. It would be one thing if the entire impact was just on the school and the conference, but it's not.

    Enrollment at U of L is not even half of what it is at UC, yet their athletic budget is not even in the same zip code as the Cardinals. That tells me that if U of L is spending a lot on facilities, marketing, transportation, etc. A slow down in all that spending will get a lot of people annoyed with the NCAA.

    I wonder if a bigger punishment, beyond the firings and scholarships, would be forcing them to change to a lower conference without the attached media contracts?

  3. #23
    Administrator Muskie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sirthought View Post
    Isn't the bigger fear at this point for imposing the death penalty not what happens to Louisville, but if the NCAA gets sued by all the TV and Radio networks, not to mention people who own the arena and other related businesses in Louisville?

    Those third party businesses and their employees don't care if a recruit's family gets some money thrown their way. They care if their investment will pay off and if they can make their own payroll. It would be one thing if the entire impact was just on the school and the conference, but it's not.

    Enrollment at U of L is not even half of what it is at UC, yet their athletic budget is not even in the same zip code as the Cardinals. That tells me that if U of L is spending a lot on facilities, marketing, transportation, etc. A slow down in all that spending will get a lot of people annoyed with the NCAA.

    I wonder if a bigger punishment, beyond the firings and scholarships, would be forcing them to change to a lower conference without the attached media contracts?
    My guess as a NCAA member, Louisvile would be required to indemnify the NCAA for their bad acts. Assuming it happened of course.
    "He's a little bit ball-dominant, he needs to have the ball in his hands, and he's not a good shooter." Ball-dominant isn't that a nice way of calling someone a ball hog? Where is my Jay Bilas Thesaurus?

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  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by sirthought View Post
    Isn't the bigger fear at this point for imposing the death penalty not what happens to Louisville, but if the NCAA gets sued by all the TV and Radio networks, not to mention people who own the arena and other related businesses in Louisville?

    Those third party businesses and their employees don't care if a recruit's family gets some money thrown their way. They care if their investment will pay off and if they can make their own payroll. It would be one thing if the entire impact was just on the school and the conference, but it's not.

    Enrollment at U of L is not even half of what it is at UC, yet their athletic budget is not even in the same zip code as the Cardinals. That tells me that if U of L is spending a lot on facilities, marketing, transportation, etc. A slow down in all that spending will get a lot of people annoyed with the NCAA.

    I wonder if a bigger punishment, beyond the firings and scholarships, would be forcing them to change to a lower conference without the attached media contracts?
    Life has consequences. Saying there should be no punishment because someone will get hurt is ludicrous. UK not being on tv for a year was a much, much bigger deal in Kentucky. Let them play, but no tv and no tournament. Arena and vendors get paid. Tv has many other schools to telecast. And maybe UL figures out once and for all that they cant operate as a bunch of dirtballs.

  5. #25
    Supporting Member xubrew's Avatar
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    I don't think a single TV or radio network would sue the NCAA. If they did, they'd assuredly lose.
    "You can't fix stupid." Ron White

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by xubrew View Post
    I don't think a single TV or radio network would sue the NCAA. If they did, they'd assuredly lose.
    I agree....

    There has to be something in the contracts that does not guarantee that any certain schools must be available for telecast, and that also says that the NCAA has the power to impose just such a ban as is being discussed.

    However.......a judge in California has just ruled that the NCAA’s “show just cause” requirement placed on a coach that was caught cheating is against California Labor Laws.

    So who the he** really has any idea what is happening in this world anymore?

  7. #27
    When just one isnt enough X-band '01's Avatar
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    Baylor of 2003-2004 is about as close to a death penalty as we may see in D-I basketball. No non-conference games and no postseason - just regular-season conference games is all they were permitted to play. I don't think they were under any TV restrictions, but they were awful after every player of note left town. That was the first year Scott Drew coached at Baylor after inheriting the mess that Dave Bliss left behind.

  8. #28
    This may be crazy, but I think the death penalty’s effect on SMU football is overstated. Don’t get me wrong, it hurt them bad, but the reason SMU is just another random football program today is not the death penalty, it is conference realignment. Its no coincidence that SMU football today is more on the level of Houston and Rice than Texas and Arkansas.
    I think a basketball program in a major conference could survive the death penalty much better than SMU football in the WAC/Conference USA/American. Basketball itself lends itself to rebuilding faster than football (15 players vs. 50 to 100), and with the best players no longer staying four years, that cycle can happen ever faster.
    The two hardest penalized programs have already been mentioned in this thread (early 90’s UK and 2000’s Baylor), and both of those programs were in the tournament within five years of their punishments. I suspect it won’t happen to Louisville, in part because Duke and Carolina and the rest of the ACC would complain about how it would put a hole in their schedule, but I don’t think the death penalty would be as harsh as the SMU story makes it out to be.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by usfldan View Post
    This may be crazy, but I think the death penalty’s effect on SMU football is overstated. Don’t get me wrong, it hurt them bad, but the reason SMU is just another random football program today is not the death penalty, it is conference realignment. Its no coincidence that SMU football today is more on the level of Houston and Rice than Texas and Arkansas.
    I think a basketball program in a major conference could survive the death penalty much better than SMU football in the WAC/Conference USA/American. Basketball itself lends itself to rebuilding faster than football (15 players vs. 50 to 100), and with the best players no longer staying four years, that cycle can happen ever faster.
    The two hardest penalized programs have already been mentioned in this thread (early 90’s UK and 2000’s Baylor), and both of those programs were in the tournament within five years of their punishments. I suspect it won’t happen to Louisville, in part because Duke and Carolina and the rest of the ACC would complain about how it would put a hole in their schedule, but I don’t think the death penalty would be as harsh as the SMU story makes it out to be.
    You are correct it is due to conference realignment, but that program was destroyed by the death penalty, making it an unattractive program to the big conference shuffle in the first place.

  10. #30
    Supporting Member GIMMFD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by X-band '01 View Post
    Baylor of 2003-2004 is about as close to a death penalty as we may see in D-I basketball. No non-conference games and no postseason - just regular-season conference games is all they were permitted to play. I don't think they were under any TV restrictions, but they were awful after every player of note left town. That was the first year Scott Drew coached at Baylor after inheriting the mess that Dave Bliss left behind.
    Yeah I think you're right here, the punishments have been less harsh coming through the ranks of the NCAA and it's a joke of an organization. They never really truly figure out what to do, and in return they look very incompetent. I think Louisville deserves some very harsh punishments, but after Penn State, Baylor football, UNC basketball, etc. it just seems they are going to get a slap on the wrist. I'd love to see this happen to them like Baylor, because it would try to help clean things up, but at the end of the day those programs are going to continue to cheat no matter what.

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