Politics Thread

[xudash]

Dash, makes you wonder if Vindman wasn't giving an accurate recount of what he heard, why didn't those other people testify and dispute his recollection?
I think he followed proper procedure in reporting his concerns to the White House counsel, but I may be wrong.

Paul, he simply didn’t do anything that was impeachable, and it certainly appears now that he didn’t do anything wrong at all.

I respect that you do not like Donald Trump.

Frankly, what I am not hearing enough, from good people regardless of political persuasion, is pure disdain for how the Democrats navigated this process to get those two bullshit charges into the Senate for consideration. I mean really.

[Caf]

Dash, makes you wonder if Vindman wasn't giving an accurate recount of what he heard, why didn't those other people testify and dispute his recollection?
I think he followed proper procedure in reporting his concerns to the White House counsel, but I may be wrong.

John Kelly Finally Lets Loose on Trump - Atlantic

John Kelly thinks he was just doing his job.

[paulxu]

Paul, he simply didn’t do anything that was impeachable, and it certainly appears now that he didn’t do anything wrong at all.

I respect that you do not like Donald Trump.

Frankly, what I am not hearing enough, from good people regardless of political persuasion, is pure disdain for how the Democrats navigated this process to get those two bullshit charges into the Senate for consideration. I mean really.

I don't like or dislike Trump. I am tremendously concerned that he was/is unfit for the job, and his time in office has damaged long-standing traditions which I believe are important for maintaining our republic.

Most importantly I think people like Kelly (as noted in the link above) are also concerned...especially about our military, State Department, and the rule of law.

Kelly notes that Vindman followed correct procedures. If what he offered in testimony, corroborated by people like Sondland, was wrong...then the other people in the room should have testified to correct it...rather than claiming some immunity that doesn't exist. The fact that they didn't speaks volumes.

[bjf123]

When pressed, didn’t Vindman testify that him saying Trump was asking for a quid pro quo was based on his interpretation of what he heard was said, not what was actually said?

As to the people not testifying, if the House Democrats really wanted them to testify, they needed to go to court to get a ruling on it. However, that would take an undetermined amount of time,possibly too close to the election, and they couldn’t afford to wait. Instead, they charge the President with obstruction of Congress because he wouldn’t let them testify. Yeah, that doesn’t work.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[xudash]

I don't like or dislike Trump. I am tremendously concerned that he was/is unfit for the job, and his time in office has damaged long-standing traditions which I believe are important for maintaining our republic.

Most importantly I think people like Kelly (as noted in the link above) are also concerned...especially about our military, State Department, and the rule of law.

Kelly notes that Vindman followed correct procedures. If what he offered in testimony, corroborated by people like Sondland, was wrong...then the other people in the room should have testified to correct it...rather than claiming some immunity that doesn't exist. The fact that they didn't speaks volumes.

Dispute, accept, whatever - - it's your call, but please don't be concerned about Donald Trump being fit for the job:

https://www.whitehouse.gov/trump-adm...complishments/

The one key longstanding tradition that has been totally abused is the failure of mainstream media to report news on an unbiased basis, a la Walter. The major newspapers aren't what they used to be, back when they reported news and not opinion pieces offered as factual reporting.

[xubrew]

I'd like Trump a lot more if he'd....

A) Stop lashing out on Twitter and in the media against other Americans, and for that matter anyone else. A good leader doesn't do that to the people they are supposed to be leading, even if he/she feels like they're being provoked. There are differences between being a good leader and a good manager, and he's not very good at being the former. What he's doing is divisive.

B) Understand and accept, and perhaps even welcome, the concept of checks and balances that our government is structured on, and try to work with the other two branches instead of seemingly trying to control them.

[Mrs. Garrett]

Dispute, accept, whatever - - it's your call, but please don't be concerned about Donald Trump being fit for the job:

https://www.whitehouse.gov/trump-adm...complishments/

The one key longstanding tradition that has been totally abused is the failure of mainstream media to report news on an unbiased basis, a la Walter. The major newspapers aren't what they used to be, back when they reported news and not opinion pieces offered as factual reporting.

Well this is coming from the most credible source.

[xudash]

Well this is coming from the most credible source.

Exactly. Because you aren't going to see it on CBS, NBC, ABC, CNN, et al.

Anything in that list you care to dispute?

[Mrs. Garrett]

Exactly. Because you aren't going to see it on CBS, NBC, ABC, CNN, et al.

Anything in that list you care to dispute?

Economic growth was more like 2% in Q4 2019. People are being kicked off food stamps not lifted off because they are doing better, Just kicked off when they still need them. But it's a cute attempt at a positive spin.

[xudash]

I'd like Trump a lot more if he'd....

A) Stop lashing out on Twitter and in the media against other Americans, and for that matter anyone else. A good leader doesn't do that to the people they are supposed to be leading, even if he/she feels like they're being provoked. There are differences between being a good leader and a good manager, and he's not very good at being the former. What he's doing is divisive.

B) Understand and accept, and perhaps even welcome, the concept of checks and balances that our government is structured on, and try to work with the other two branches instead of seemingly trying to control them.

Agree with you on both points, but with two things to consider:

Re A: He is under attack from all quarters. The Far Left press loved the Community Organizer, even though he was a terrible, ineffective President. They loathe Trump. If you're asking him to, as an example, refer to Joe Biden as Senator Biden or Mr. Biden instead of "Sleepy Joe", I'm not sure that's a fair request, given what Biden has and is saying about Trump. You say "well, rise above that fracas" and be a statesman. I'm simply saying it hasn't been a fair contest with Trump. Do I think he should lay off Twitter completely? No, because he is talking over the Far Left media to the people. Do I believe some of his tweets about celebrities and such would have been better left unsent? Absolutely.

Re B: Bullshit on one key point that you are failing to acknowledge. The House, under Pelosi, is operating in full obstructionist mode. He has tried to work with these idiots in the past.

The Speaker of the House, in one of the greatest bullshit moves in the history of the United States, tore-up the President's State of the Union speech on live television. BOTH sides have to find a way to get back to a working relationship. But I have news for you: the Far Left is taking over and ruining the Democratic Party. AOC and her ilk are looking for a revolution.

Trump stands there talking about policies and efforts on multiple matters that are for the United States and its citizens. He notes government data of documented progress. He makes a Tuskegee airman a general. He announces a scholarship for a little African-American girl that had been out of reach for her up until that point. It goes on and on that evening, and yet, when the television cameras pan to the Democrats in the room, they mostly sit still, appearing as though they are against economic vitality, protecting borders, proper immigration, a strong military, etc.

Trump is divisive. He would do well to tone it down a little and become more "presidential" through this election cycle. Of course, he would be accused of not being sincere about it. But this conversation doesn't end with him. Pelosi and her band of ignorant disciples have to come around, too.

In summary, you are missing a "C": what the Democrats must do in order to foster an environment of working together. "C" will not be forthcoming anytime soon. That is the Democrats fault. And as it presently sits, they're going to pay dearly for it in November.