Where is the outrage, again.

[muskienick]

First off, let me say, I am pro bike path, and particularly pro Wasson Way as it benefits me disproportionately.

http://www.cincinnati.com/story/news...sale/28293887/

The city is buying the right of way for $11m+ and construction will be over $7m. With overruns and delays, this is easily a $20m+ project, which covers somewhere between 4 and 7 miles (there are conflicting numbers in different places). That is not cheap. The economic impact studies are vague. Other than "a bike trail would be nice", I have no idea what criteria were used to determine that this is the next best project for the city to pursue. I'm sure it's just a total coincidence that our mayor lives within a mile of this.

But I continue to be amazed at the way capital projects are randomly evaluated and executed in this city. There has been an ongoing debate over the clifton grocery store and a proposed $550K recoverable loan. Ultimately that project was denied. The highly publicized Mahogany's investment was a total disaster. The "Kennedy Connector" was a new $35 million project that was supposed to open up new development. I walked it the other day. Unless they are developing dirt, there's not much going on over there. In fact, the spinning place that was right over there actually relocated out. Mad Tree is crushing it, but they are on commercial property that has been in use for years.

The mess that is I 75 and the bridge to connect Cincinnati state to the westside is destined to be a battle and a disaster. Finishing the bike path connection to downtown from the eastside continues to be a fight. There's also been some sort of transportation thing on rails downtown, but I haven't heard much about it. Potholes go unfilled while bike lanes get installed on Delta Avenue.

This town seems to just throw dice to decide what projects move forward, and the media is just as random in the positions it takes on those projects.

Here's what a 2013 article stated about the Kennedy Connector: "Over-all the goal of the Kennedy Connector Project is to improve traffic flow and connectivity in the Ridge and Madison Road and Duck Creek corridors by extending Kennedy Avenue. It has an estimated price tag of $35 million and will open up 45 to 50 acres of property for future development."

The Kennedy Connector was opened on December 30, 2013 on time and under budget. There has been only one construction season between then and now and one would surmise that developers of the relatively area remaining for "future development" would have to be contacted and then do an exhaustive study to determine traffic flow and land-usage feasibility (parking, ingress and egress, ambient traffic noise, retail vs profession vs residential vs etc.) before investing million$ of private funding on such a project. I imagine that is why they used the word, 'future' to describe the possible development that could occur related to the Kennedy Connector.

[Kahns Krazy]

What? The Kennedy connector project began in May of 2012. That's three years. There was an economic impact study that should have had all of the above requirements laid out before the work even began. If the study was right, developers should have had projects lined up the minute that thing opened. The Taft Ale House guys bought the building, sunk $9 million into construction and opened within 15 months of the Streetcar announcement. It's been 18 months since the connector opened, and there hasn't been a single shovelful of dirt moved. Meanwhile, debt service on $35 million piles up...


My point is that there is no comprehensive strategy for how any of these projects get awarded, no long term plan, no stack ranking of best uses of dollars spent, and no transparency to the public at all. There is certainly no post-mortem on these projects. The purchase price for the Wasson right of way has to come from somewhere. How do we know if the Wasson Project was the highest and best possible use of those dollars when we don't even know what the source of the funding is?

Proponents of one project will use the exact same argument they bash in another argument. Economic studies that are dismissed for the streetcar are embraced for the new I-71 exit into Clifton. Pet projects move forward while others stall out.

Are there any bike paths at all on the westside? I am not aware of any, though I'm not over there that often anymore. Certainly, all of the path development that makes the news is on the eastside. What's up with that? How can that be any part of a cohesive plan?

[X-man]

I live in Terrace Park and work at Xavier. I can't wait for the bike trail that goes by my house to be connected to the Wasson Way trail.

[fellahmuskie]

What? The Kennedy connector project began in May of 2012. That's three years. There was an economic impact study that should have had all of the above requirements laid out before the work even began. If the study was right, developers should have had projects lined up the minute that thing opened. The Taft Ale House guys bought the building, sunk $9 million into construction and opened within 15 months of the Streetcar announcement. It's been 18 months since the connector opened, and there hasn't been a single shovelful of dirt moved. Meanwhile, debt service on $35 million piles up...


My point is that there is no comprehensive strategy for how any of these projects get awarded, no long term plan, no stack ranking of best uses of dollars spent, and no transparency to the public at all. There is certainly no post-mortem on these projects. The purchase price for the Wasson right of way has to come from somewhere. How do we know if the Wasson Project was the highest and best possible use of those dollars when we don't even know what the source of the funding is?

Proponents of one project will use the exact same argument they bash in another argument. Economic studies that are dismissed for the streetcar are embraced for the new I-71 exit into Clifton. Pet projects move forward while others stall out.

Are there any bike paths at all on the westside? I am not aware of any, though I'm not over there that often anymore. Certainly, all of the path development that makes the news is on the eastside. What's up with that? How can that be any part of a cohesive plan?

Do you read the Cincyopolis blog? The lady who runs it does a great job of asking these questions, in my opinion, and trying to find answers.

[Kahns Krazy]

And Thor, just to make sure I'm clear, I am pro Wasson Way. I have attending meetings and I have walked the path. I know the kind of benefit this will bring. I know there are other sources of funding, just as there are for the streetcar, and I know there are benefits that go beyond "Isn't that nice", like reduction in crime, and future connections to transportation, just like there are for the streetcar.

Paths, where possible and especially where they contribute to a transportation route, are certainly more beneficial than lanes, though they are also much more expensive.

My only minor concern on this project is going to be the intersections at Paxton and Edwards, which are already messy intersections. I'm sure people will get used to it.

[Kahns Krazy]

Do you read the Cincyopolis blog? The lady who runs it does a great job of asking these questions, in my opinion, and trying to find answers.

Hey thanks for that link! On my favorites now.

[PM Thor]

And Thor, just to make sure I'm clear, I am pro Wasson Way. I have attending meetings and I have walked the path. I know the kind of benefit this will bring. I know there are other sources of funding, just as there are for the streetcar, and I know there are benefits that go beyond "Isn't that nice", like reduction in crime, and future connections to transportation, just like there are for the streetcar.

Paths, where possible and especially where they contribute to a transportation route, are certainly more beneficial than lanes, though they are also much more expensive.

My only minor concern on this project is going to be the intersections at Paxton and Edwards, which are already messy intersections. I'm sure people will get used to it.

Yeah, I have no idea how they are going to do the Wasson/Edwards corner, it's a train wreck as it is now, throwing in a cross for the Wasson Way is going to be a major hurdle. The Paxton corner though isn't nearly as problematic, it's just moving the northbound light to the southside of the path and putting up signage alerting drivers. As for a couple of your concerns, we do know where the funds are coming from, the ONLY reason the price on the project was put forth this week is because those behind the scenes know that the TIGER grant is going to be granted, otherwise the whole project would be DOA. Yes, I am aware of the high up front cost for the project, but the back end maintenance cost for bike trails truly is negligible. For example look at the Little Miami Bike Trail, volunteers actually step in and do a lot of the work on the trail (Friends of the Little Miami State Park) and chip in for bigger projects.

As for the Kennedy connector, there is major construction occurring just to the west of it, from new grocery stores (2nd biggest Kroger in the country, woot!) to condos, to storefronts. The impact of the connector won't be fully realized for years, if not even decades. It's not like that project was done all willy-nilly, and there was reasoning behind it. Just because you weren't aware of those reasons, that doesn't mean the people involved behind the project didn't know the construction was coming. You build the infrastructure for it before the actual construction starts (Go behind Crossroads, near the Cinemark/Sams plaza area, quite a few roads going around fields right now....perhaps the roads were put in because expansion is coming?)

[Muskie1000]

I live in Loveland where we have a fantastic bike trail. I hardly ever use it because I'm not a biker, however, that being said... it is great for Loveland. There are many small shops that you can stop at and I know a lot of people who travel there to come and use it. Just to have it is a great incentive to people to want to come there. If you've never come out there, the bike trail stretches fairly far (along parts of the Little Miami as stated). Personally I would rather government invest money in that than in more retail shops and apartments.

[D-West & PO-Z]

I live in Loveland where we have a fantastic bike trail. I hardly ever use it because I'm not a biker, however, that being said... it is great for Loveland. There are many small shops that you can stop at and I know a lot of people who travel there to come and use it. Just to have it is a great incentive to people to want to come there. If you've never come out there, the bike trail stretches fairly far (along parts of the Little Miami as stated). Personally I would rather government invest money in that than in more retail shops and apartments.

The Loveland Bike Trail, where I have spent every Mother's Day for as long as I can remember. My mom loves it and she isnt an avid biker or anything. She just loves the outdoors. I always considered it a win when I was a kid if I could convince her going to a Reds game would be a great idea for Mother's Day instead. I think that only worked once.

[paulxu]

I always considered it a win when I was a kid if I could convince her going to a Reds game would be a great idea for Mother's Day instead. I think that only worked once.

I'm going to assume the one time it worked was 1990.

So...do I blame you or your mom for our World Series drought since 1976.