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  1. #11
    Supporting Member GuyFawkes38's Avatar
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    It's an adorable school for an adorable conference (it's fun to sound patronizing towards the A10 now). Just joking.

    Davidson is a nice, logical pick up.
    Last edited by GuyFawkes38; 05-09-2013 at 01:27 PM.
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  2. #12
    Supporting Member xubrew's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LA Muskie View Post
    I like Davidson and I think this is a great pickup for the A-10. I have to say the conference is doing a good job of backfilling. Which I love because it means Dayton should generally remain a middling average/above average member.
    Most likely.

    Dayton is typically tough to beat at home. The place can be a snake pit. But, away from home, they're below average most of the time. Average that out, and you've got a middling average/above average member. I think VCU will be a consistent frontrunner, and I really do think Davidson will be viable and competing for at-large bids most of the time. All and all, I think the league is as good as it was before, and maybe even a little better, and I think Dayton's place within the league will remain pretty much the same. I could be wrong, but they've been stagnant for a long time and have given very little indication that that will change.
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  3. #13
    I still believe. muskiefan82's Avatar
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    I have a hardtime saying the A-10 might be better after losing Xavier, Butler and Temple. VCU is a good replacement for any one of the 3, but Davidson is not on the same level. Neither is George Mason.
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  4. #14
    Supporting Member bobbiemcgee's Avatar
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    ditto
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  5. #15
    Supporting Member xubrew's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by muskiefan82 View Post
    I have a hardtime saying the A-10 might be better after losing Xavier, Butler and Temple. VCU is a good replacement for any one of the 3, but Davidson is not on the same level. Neither is George Mason.
    If you count Butler, then the league isn't better. They were only there for a year, though, so when I say I think the league will be as good as it was "before", I mean before Butler.

    Before Butler, Xavier was a constant frontrunner, and we typically saw between one and three more teams that were in contention to get an at-large bid, and rarely was it as many as three teams other than Xavier.

    Moving forward, I think VCU will be a constant frontrunner, and...well....we'll see between one and three additional teams in contention for an at-large bid.

    As I've said before, I really like Davidson, and can see them being a team that's in the at-large discussion most of the time similar to how Temple was.

    Other than that, I think it will fluctuate like it always did. Richmond was good for a time. Saint Joe's was good every now and then. SLU was good this past year. Even GW was good for a minute a few years back....but just for a minute. Right now, La Salle and UMass appear to be trending up. So, yeah, I think it will be as good as it was before...as in before Temple and VCU joined. Maybe even a little better.
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  6. #16
    Supporting Member DC Muskie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xubrew View Post
    Maybe even a little better.
    "Better" how?

    By tournament bids?

    By non conference wins?

    GW has won two conference tournaments in 37 years of membership in the A10.

    Entering next season, SJU will be nine years removed from their last conference title.

    LaSalle made their first tournament appearance in 21 years, SBU made it last year after 12, and that was their first trip since 1978.

    Since becoming a member in 2001, Richmond has never won the regular season title and won one conference tournament. They have the same number of Sweet 16's as Davidson does in the last 25 years.

    I could go on and on. All of these programs have had their moments. But they are few and far between. VCU looks like the Xavier in this league because they won before they got into the A10 and won when they got there. Let's wait and see if Davidson can win in the A10 before we start saying they are the next Temple.

    But "better" than the old A10? No way.
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  7. #17
    Supporting Member xubrew's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DC Muskie View Post
    "Better" how?

    By tournament bids?

    By non conference wins?

    GW has won two conference tournaments in 37 years of membership in the A10.

    Entering next season, SJU will be nine years removed from their last conference title.

    LaSalle made their first tournament appearance in 21 years, SBU made it last year after 12, and that was their first trip since 1978.

    Since becoming a member in 2001, Richmond has never won the regular season title and won one conference tournament. They have the same number of Sweet 16's as Davidson does in the last 25 years.

    I could go on and on. All of these programs have had their moments. But they are few and far between. VCU looks like the Xavier in this league because they won before they got into the A10 and won when they got there. Let's wait and see if Davidson can win in the A10 before we start saying they are the next Temple.

    But "better" than the old A10? No way.
    Pretty much everything you said validates the fact that the A10 wasn't that good before, so why does everyone think it is such a stretch to say that the league will continue to be the same that it was?? In a good year, the A10 was the 7th best overall conference. There were a few years that Xavier was the only that was anywhere close to earning an at-large bid. So, yes, I think the tournament bids and non-conference wins will be about the same...and MAYBE even a little better. I think some of the programs, such as LaSalle and UMass, are actually trending up. After years of being stagnant and not giving a crap, some of them actually appear to be trying to get better.
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  8. #18
    Supporting Member DC Muskie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xubrew View Post
    Pretty much everything you said validates the fact that the A10 wasn't that good before, so why does everyone think it is such a stretch to say that the league will continue to be the same that it was?? In a good year, the A10 was the 7th best overall conference. There were a few years that Xavier was the only that was anywhere close to earning an at-large bid. So, yes, I think the tournament bids and non-conference wins will be about the same...and MAYBE even a little better. I think some of the programs, such as LaSalle and UMass, are actually trending up. After years of being stagnant and not giving a crap, some of them actually appear to be trying to get better.
    Because there are no more schools like Xavier and Temple who have built themselves into consistent at large participants in the dance. None of those schools added are capable of doing home and home against stronger schools, that will provide them the opportunity to win.

    You seemed to argue that since GW was good way back when and Richmond was good, the A10 could be even better with the addition of Davidson. I don't get that. Losing Xavier, Temple and yes even Butler hurts that conference greatly. The A10 had what, five bids last year? That's three right there. I don't think Davidson or Mason have the resources to be consistently good as Xavier and Temple. The A10 will most likely turn into a two or possible three bid league. It's basically turning more into the old CAA, then being better than the old A10.
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  9. #19
    Supporting Member DC Muskie's Avatar
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    And yes I'm listening to music as I write this and totally realized just now we did not in fact go to the tournament last year.

    I am terrible at multitasking on a Friday afternoon.
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  10. #20
    Supporting Member xubrew's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DC Muskie View Post
    Because there are no more schools like Xavier and Temple who have built themselves into consistent at large participants in the dance. None of those schools added are capable of doing home and home against stronger schools, that will provide them the opportunity to win.

    You seemed to argue that since GW was good way back when and Richmond was good, the A10 could be even better with the addition of Davidson. I don't get that. Losing Xavier, Temple and yes even Butler hurts that conference greatly. The A10 had what, five bids last year? That's three right there. I don't think Davidson or Mason have the resources to be consistently good as Xavier and Temple. The A10 will most likely turn into a two or possible three bid league. It's basically turning more into the old CAA, then being better than the old A10.
    That's not what I'm arguing at all.

    Let me try again.

    The Atlantic Ten of old generally saw Xavier as a frontrunner, and maybe one or two (and in a very good year three) other teams who were in a position to get an at-large bid.

    I think the new Atlantic Ten will generally see VCU as a frontrunner, and maybe one or two (and in a very good year three) other teams that are in a position to get an at-large bid. I think Davidson will be one of those teams most of the time.

    Last year, the Atlantic Ten got five teams in, but two of them were VCU and Butler, who weren't in the league "BEFORE.' People who are disagreeing with me are acting like Butler and VCU had been in the league all along, and that the league was always producing five teams that were safely in the field. if you take out Butler and VCU, the league was about the same as it was before. It certainly wasn't any worse, and was maybe a little bit better. L

    VCU earned a #5 seed. I can only think of three years where Xavier earned a seed better than that. (2003, 2008, 2009). In looking at VCU, I think they're going to continue to be as good as they have been, and probably even improve.


    So, my argument/anticipation is that VCU will be a solid frontrunner, Davidson will be in the picture more often than not, and everyone else will be between average and mediocre most of the time, but will compete for NCAA tournament bids some of the time on a fluctuating basis. Just like before. The only reason I mentioned GW was to show that no one was consistent, but several teams put together good teams on occasion. I think that will continue.
    "You can't fix stupid." Ron White

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