Thank you, Thrillhouse, thank you. But you and I know damn well that won't make any difference in some minds. And when he's inducted into the Hall of Fame, the same fans in this town who ripped the living sh!t out of him will call him an ungrateful bastard for not wearing a Cincinnati cap. Sure shows you can't come home again. Now I guess we'll hear from those who allegedly knew him in his high school days and maybe he didn't run hard to first...oh, hell what's the difference?
Results 21 to 30 of 30
Thread: Junior vs A-Rod
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05-07-2009, 01:56 AM #21
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05-07-2009, 06:01 AM #22
I hear ya Q. I don't know why I care so much, but the hate Junior received in this town just always irritated the hell out of me. Outside of Bonds, I can't think of another player that I heard heckled as much as I did Jr. I don't care if someone doesn't love Griffey, but to heckle someone that plays on your team is just weak. And I don't remember anyone in this town hating Sean Casey despite the ridiculous contract Jim Bowden gave him even though Casey was nothing more than an average hitter and the last couple of years in Cincy only thing he did well was hit into double plays. Oh right, gee golly whiz he sure was a heck of a nice guy! (note: I liked Casey, just hated the contract Bowden gave him)
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05-07-2009, 06:03 AM #23
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05-07-2009, 07:24 AM #24
Marty does come across as holier than thou at times and he is overally critical of some players that he obviously doesn't care for. I'm not really a fan of Brantley either. I don't like the drawl and the constant talk of food; he also seems a bit smug to me but maybe it's just my perception.
Zip'em Up!
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05-07-2009, 07:30 AM #25
...and back to the thread. As an outsider who was not born and raised in Cincy but as somone that has been here for over 20 years now, I am amazed at the bizarre level of hate/dislike for Griffey by this town. He's not "Mr. Charlie Hustle"/Pete Rose, I get that. However, the guy is not nearly as bad as some make him out to be.
When healthy, he put up good numbers for the most part here. He does a lot of charity work that he never tried to promote or get publicity for and yet there are still "haters" out there. Go figure.Zip'em Up!
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05-07-2009, 07:44 AM #26
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When you hit .250 (maybe) in the 3 hole, don't hustle, take a majority of the salary, and act like a baby, I don't consider it far-fetched to be hated by passionate reds fans. The contract wasn't his fault, and to a degree, maybe the injuries weren't his fault (his work ethic I believe has a little to do with the injuries), but the lack of hustle and production along with attitude is definitely his fault.
The hate rolls on. And by the way, he will never get a ring. Himself and A-Rod will go out as darn good baseball players, but they will never have THE hardware. One on steroids, the other, we have no evidence YET. Take the MVP trophies, the homeruns, and the gold gloves, but the ultimate prize is and will always be......just a dream.
As far as Ken Griffey Jr. wearing a Mariners hat to his hall of fame induction, I wouldn't want it any other way. The Reds will probably have their 6th World Championship by that time.
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05-07-2009, 08:46 AM #27
All right, I have to chime in. Look, Griffey is one of the greatest ballplayers ever. The guy was on the all century team. He's won MVP awards, gold gloves.
His first year here, 2000, the guy hit 40 home runs and knocked in over 100. So I guess the Reds not doing as well as they did in 1999 was his fault. Anyone remember the hysteria in this city when they traded for him? Anyone go down to Riverfront to try to get season tickets? I did - the place was a zoo with a line out the door - waited 3 hours to get in to get tickets. Spring training was a media frenzy - the guy was THE story in 2000. The Reds drew 500,000 more fans in 2000. Let's assume the average fan spends $20 on a ticket, food, parking and souvenirs. That's 10 mil in extra revenue right there.
Is it Griffey's fault that the Reds didn't develop? I guess so, because he robbed this franchise of the greatness of Mike ".240" Cameron and Brett Tomko. Worst trade in Reds history? (I know that comment was only meant to get a rise, 87)
Injuries robbed him of his speed and range. Yeah, maybe he didn't hustle like he should have at times late in his career, maybe he was surly at times and he didn't belong in the 3 spot later in his career (by the way, his on base, except for 1 year was exceptional).
The problem was the Reds (i.e., Lindner) refused to build around Griffey (and to a certain extent, Larkin). He spent the money on these two but instead of realizing that they were special circumstances (like he had hinted when they were signed to their contracts) held them as part of his budget. Plus, the success of 1999 skewed things for the Reds - they were building to have a good team for the opening of the new park. 1999 was a fluke year and gave management a false sense of optimism - they simply had players that had career years that year (and still failed to make the playoffs).
Hindsight is a wonderful thing. His time here was a disappointment, but generally because of circumstances out of his control. You cannot avoid shoulder separations, torn ligaments (completely off the bone, by the way) and torn patellar tendons. Even with those injuries, he was productive. Not the top shelf player he was in Seattle, but he still produced.
As for him hitting in the 3 spot, I agree that he was there too long. But look at the guys he played for - Bob Boone? Dave Miley? These guys were awful managers who simply were intimidated by Junior and wouldn't take him out of the 3 spot.
Look at him after the trade. Did he complain about not being in everyday in Chicago? How about now in Seattle? Then why place the blame on him here for being placed in the 3 hole?
As for the steroids argument, that belongs with Hettel's "independent" thread as craziest theories ever. Is there any evidence, other than in your head, that he used steroids? Wow - he was a teammate of ARod's. Well, so was Giomar Guevara - I guess he juiced, too.
I admit, I'm biased towards Griffey - he and Larkin are fellow alums who were there when I was. I won't defend his attitude at times (he was not Ernie Banks by any stretch), but I will defend his record as a ballplayer. Blaming him for the Reds woes of the past 9 years is ludicrous and shows a laziness and lack of true understanding of how the Reds worked.
Sorry for the length of the rant.
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05-07-2009, 09:17 AM #28
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Griffey haters are hilarious. They complain that he doesnt hustle and he doesnt try hard enough, then when he gets injured doing so they complain that he gets hurt too much. He got hurt while trying to make plays, yet fans still gave him garbage for it.
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05-07-2009, 09:32 AM #29
Why is that if you criticize Griffey, you're a "Griffey hater"? I criticized Sean Miller becasue he recruited Parrom. Am I now a Sean Miller hater?
So I'll say it again. I don't "hate" Griffey. However, he often was a lazy player who, at times, didn't hustle on the field. And he had an entitlement attitude in the clubhouse which caused problems.Last edited by XU 87; 05-07-2009 at 09:52 AM.
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05-07-2009, 09:50 AM #30
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