How am I just now hearing about this!?!?Quote:
Originally Posted by cutterX
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How am I just now hearing about this!?!?Quote:
Originally Posted by cutterX
You gotta get out more often. Take a mask when you go.
(also, happy anniversary on the Dana's deal)
I’ll start by saying I agree 100% on the wearing of masks. Now let me help you make the argument so you don’t look like a douche liberal, and actually convince people masks are a good idea.Quote:
Originally Posted by cutterX
1. The obvious rebuttal for your wife is that she gets paid nicely to wear a mask. Totally different, bad argument. Don’t do that again.
2. Pork rinds? Who eats those? Oh, never mind, I know... just go ahead and say “deplorables”.
If you want to make a case for masks, great. Find some scientific basis for why they work and cite that. Do you want to insult or influence?
Well said Muskie in Dayton
WTF??? Is the word of our leading disease experts not "scientific basis"? Or alternatively, what about the experience of countries that did/do use such protocols (every other major country except us) vs. the US (the only major country where lots of people, and in some cases their elected officials, decide that the science is inconvenient, and they don't want "the man" telling them what to do)?Quote:
Originally Posted by Muskie in dayton
Most of the "leading" countries stopped testing. For example:Quote:
Originally Posted by X-man
So while our numbers are "horrifying", it's because of our testing numbers.Quote:
Jordan Schachtel
@JordanSchachtel
Japan has 500k tests w 125MM pop. Taiwan 78k. Pop. 25MM
US has conducted > 40 million tests.
China is just lying about its numbers so disregard them.
But every country with a massive testing regime (especially postmortem testing) has seen loads of deaths+cases.
Common sense!
And on the flip side, there are countries that took extreme measures like...
And I don't want to live under a government that can enact the measures that those countries did. Others may disagree, but if we can't get people to wear masks, why would they submit to even stricter measures?Quote:
Jordan Schachtel
@JordanSchachtel
The only countries that have been able to *stop* the spread w a heightened testing regime have initiated brutal lockdowns & massive surveillance states. Think Israel & S Korea. And still, they may find it impossible to *stop* the spread when all is said and done. Not worth it.
Uh, my post was about people asking about masks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Juice
Yeah the science based arguments seem to fall on deaf years, especially with the QAnon and Anti-vax folks. Instead the one argument that I have seen start to work is "if you don't wear a mask we won't have football in the fall." Screw appealing to the common good, instead appeal to personal motivations.Quote:
Originally Posted by X-man
And my point is that certain countries are seen as doing better than us, but if they actually tested at our rate, wouldn’t be seen the same way.Quote:
Originally Posted by X-man
Are you saying that there are way more cases in those other countries than are being reported, because they aren't testing? If so, there should be higher hospitalization rates in those countries, which isn't happening. If you are saying that less testing means fewer cases, i.e. more testing means that more people are sick (rather than just being found as sick), then we have nothing to talk about because I can't reason with such "magical thinking".Quote:
Originally Posted by Juice
I think you missed the point of my post. Go back and ready that and I think you'll calm down.Quote:
Originally Posted by X-man
But to the point of your post... trust but verify. Xavier taught some great critical thinking skills that need to be used - especially in this age of misinformation. Blindly following anything is a bad idea.
I appreciate your comment. My reply was more directed to people who still don't understand the basis for requiring masks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Muskie in dayton
More positive cases does not equal an increased hospitalization rate.Quote:
Originally Posted by X-man
Tell that to the people in Texas, Florida, and Arizona.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xville
Here is some evidence that masks don't work:Quote:
Originally Posted by X-man
https://twitter.com/AlexBerenson/sta...507775488?s=20
https://apps.who.int/iris/bitstream/...1-eng.pdf?ua=1 (Page 21-26)
Tell me about their death rates.Quote:
Originally Posted by X-man
3 of the lowest states in the country when you look at Deaths per million.
New York and New Jersey and Michigan and Massachusetts and Rhode Island? All run by Democrats?
Uhhhhhh........
And that masks do work: http://files.fast.ai/papers/masks_lit_review.pdfQuote:
Originally Posted by Juice
Uhhhh, the issue in question was hospitalizations.Quote:
Originally Posted by Masterofreality
This article pertains to mask effectiveness against the spread of influenza (flu) viruses, not coronaviruses. The flu is capable of spreading through aerosols (extremely small particles emitted that can pass through a mask), so no, masks don't help. Coronavirus seems to have limited or no aerosol transmission - it primarily spread by droplets emitted form the nose/mouth (larger particles). Masks stop droplets, and therefore, mitigate spread of COVID-19.Quote:
Originally Posted by Juice
Wear the mask please.
Testing at different rates can twist the picture in too many ways. I’ll follow deaths, and hope they don’t start rising again after the current spike in positive cases.
Oh, and I’ll gladly wear a mask in stores while avoiding crowded places.
I think the spike has been going on too long for it simply to be a lag issue at this point. Deaths might tick up a bit, but we're not going back to the worst days of April (in my oh so expert opinion). A lot of milder/asymptomatic cases being detected that weren't early on, and younger, healthier people who aren't prone to die are getting it (or at least their cases are now being diagnosed).
Actually MOR, this is false. It may have been true 3-4 weeks ago, but now is a less than ideal time to tout Republican-run states in the death rate too. But since you asked, here are the numbers for new death rates, adjusted by population:Quote:
Originally Posted by Masterofreality
Florida
Arizona
Texas
This is a very bad trend. And we need to keep a real close eye on Ohio because our hospitalizations are increasing now as they were not 1-2 weeks ago. Deaths will follow hospitalizations. Maybe not at the same rate as April but it won’t be a drastic improvement.
What I’d like to know is if these younger people now showing up as infected are getting tested because they’re symptomatic, or are they getting tested because they just want to know?Quote:
Originally Posted by GoMuskies
Yesterday, I heard that there are 34,000 hospital beds in Ohio and about 850 are being used by someone with Covid. I don’t remember the details about ICU beds, but those beds are also mostly empty or not used by a Covid related case.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I’m seeing more articles casting doubt on the ability to develop a safe and effective vaccine. It very well be here to stay and we need to accept it and live lives with it.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/may/22/why-we-might-not-get-a-coronavirus-vaccine
Yes this is here to stay for awhile. Better to get use to it and move on. We also will be dealing with about 25 million flu cases during flu season as well. Should be fun.Quote:
Originally Posted by Muskie in dayton
Fun? Like a party? Why do I feel like the piñata for the 2020 party?Quote:
Originally Posted by xavierj
Just curious, am I the only person who had to Google QAnon? If so, I will now try to leave my current occupancy under the rock.Quote:
Originally Posted by STL_XUfan
No. I did as well and am still a bit confused. Embrace the under the rock.Quote:
Originally Posted by noteggs
This is a few years old, but this podcast is a good primer into the QAnon craziness:Quote:
Originally Posted by noteggs
https://gimletmedia.com/shows/reply-...the-qanon-code
US Deaths per Million TODAY: 415Quote:
Originally Posted by Lloyd Braun
Texas Deaths Per Million: 111 (1/4 US)
Arizona Deaths Per Million: 296 (Way Less)
Florida Deaths Per Million: 195 (1/2 US)
Source: Worldometers.info
Not false at all and your graph is incredibly deceptive- for Florida it shows 1, that's ONE extra death per day. Arizona 2 more per day in the last two weeks, Texas 1.5 more per day in the last two weeks. Not a crisis. The upward trend is a bit concerning but NOT A CRISIS. That could have easily been explained by crowds of people protesting and rioting in the streets, not normal people living their lives.
New York Deaths per Million: 1,665
New Jersey Deaths per Million: 1,757
Michigan Deaths per Million: 632
Massachusetts Deaths Per Million: 1,206
Rhode Island Deaths Per Million: 921
Oh, and just for the hell of it- Connecticut Deaths per Million: 1,220
As for Ohio, right now there are 850 hospital beds taken for Covid patients out of 32,500. The last 24 hour reported hospitalizations was 69 which was lower than the 21 day reported average of 75/day. The ICU admissions in the last 24 hours were 8, which is half of the 21 day reported average of 16. I think we're OK.
But....WEAR A MASK!
MOR- of course New York’s death/million number is higher, they’ve gone through a massive spike already. Check back at the end of this and see where the totals are. But the CURRENT death rate over the last couple weeks is significantly higher in Arizona, Florida etc.. There was a quote earlier in this thread that said we are playing Monday Morning Quarterback and it isn’t even Monday.
Taking one day on the weekend in Ohio (when not all admissions are not reported) to say we are fine because that single day is lower than a 21 day average is a strange/short sighted way of approaching this. I too think we are fine for now but we are trending poorly, and failure to recognize that could be a problem come school time.
But yea, keep making this political and tout the response by the Republicans if that’s what makes you feel better about this. Many of these posts are going to look silly at the end, much like many from April and early May.
Texas, Arizona and Florida are just now starting into their spikes. Hopefully their death tolls won't be as severe as the Northeast.
They won’t be. They actually started the spikes over a month ago. Shortly after Memorial Day, early June. Younger people are the ones testing positive so you won’t see huge death spikes. A lot that are positive Are not even feeling sick. The reason it was so bad in New York was because of so many deaths in nursing homes and the older population. That doesn’t seem to be happening at the same rate in Texas, Florida and Arizona. Even California who has had a lot of cases all along has not experienced anywhere near the death rates that New York saw.Quote:
Originally Posted by paulxu
Why New York's Governor is getting a pass on killing so many seniors is beyond me.
Ha!! You’ve made it political the whole time every time you bring up “Government response” then decry what you think is the lack of it. BTW. New York is starting to have a second spike and they especially screwed this up the first time, but at least they seem to be getting some herd immunity. There’s that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lloyd Braun
What is silly is you pulling out “charts” that try to prove a point of a “crisis” when they barely show an uptick, and also claiming that you were concerned about hospitals when there is no where near any sort of a problem.
https://www.smh.com.au/world/north-a...10-p55avm.html
Pretty obvious right? Chris Cuomo has an evening show on CNN and fawns all over his brother. You know. The same Chris Cuomo who tested positive, broke Quarantine, and now lectures people who don't wear masks?Quote:
Originally Posted by chico
I am equally critical/complimentary of government response on both sides for this issue, you are very partisan on this issue continually pointing out Democratic deficiencies. How’s Florida looking since you praised their Republican governor? Any criticism for him now?Quote:
Originally Posted by Masterofreality
Regarding the graph, it is hard data on Ohio’s hospitalization rate. We peaked a bit over 100/day in early April and it declined to about half of that 3 weeks ago (48/day). In 3 weeks since, it has nearly doubled to a bit less that 100/day as a 7 day average (best metric to measure current data). And again, I didn’t say we are in a “crisis” state in Ohio, said that we need to “keep a close eye” on Ohio.
Florida is now #1!!!!!!! Unfortunately that's for the number of new covid cases in a day here in the US.
What is the big deal with cases? Yeah we will have a lot. We have over 26 million flu cases every year. Florida have 210,000 more cases than Ohio yet only 1,000 more deaths. I guess Florida must not be killing all the people in nursing homes like a lot of states, including Ohio, did early on.Quote:
Originally Posted by X-man
Florida is in trouble .... their positivity rate is around 20% and the hospitals in their heavily populated areas are approaching capacity. They have a lot of nursing home deaths as well, and when you look at the average age of death it’s not much different there than anywhere. In hindsight, nursing homes should have had stricter regulations earlier for their employees but it is so difficult to implement.Quote:
Originally Posted by xavierj
I think the NBA should relocate but the money involved must be too much set in stone. In 3 weeks it could be ugly there.