Covid-19

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Originally Posted by XU_Lou

Question: How many times has Fauci, Walensky, Biden, the media and the CDC told us that 99% of covid deaths were from unvaccinated people?

Is/was this a bold face lie?

In a CDC slide presentation obtained by the Washington Post, the CDC shows that 15% of deaths in May were among fully vaccinated people! (and the trend doesn't look pretty) Again, how many times do I have to point out that they are lying to you - for the last 18 months this crew has lied about every aspect of this entire "pandemic".

How many times did they tell us that the vaccines had a 95% efficacy rate? The document shows that this rate is actually 61%!

A few other key quotes from the WAPO article:

"Another estimates that there are 35,000 symptomatic infections per week among (a total of) 162 million vaccinated Americans."

"The breakthrough cases are to be expected, the CDC briefing states, and will probably rise as a proportion of all cases because there are so many more people vaccinated now. This echoes data seen from studies in other countries, including highly vaccinated Singapore, where 75 percent of new infections reportedly occur in people who are partially and fully vaccinated."

"Walter A. Orenstein, associate director of the Emory Vaccine Center, said he was struck by data showing that vaccinated people who became infected with delta shed just as much virus as those who were not vaccinated. The slide references an outbreak in Barnstable County, Mass., where vaccinated and unvaccinated people shed nearly identical amounts of virus."

"It is no longer even clear whether “vaccine” is right term to describe these therapies. Most other vaccines protect for decades, if not a lifetime."

Links including slide presentation:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/healt...mask-guidance/

https://www.washingtonpost.com/conte...-c6bc8426f688/

https://twitter.com/AlexBerenson/sta...38891025166340

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Totally agree on the lies we are being told by our bureaucrats and media. But that trend you refer to is not concerning, but expected. As vaccination rates increase, there are fewer unvaccinated, so one should expect the percent of deaths in vaccinated people to increase. One of your quotes addresses this.

On a side note, I challenge anyone here to find data on the number of reinfection deaths.

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Originally Posted by Strange Brew

The problem going forward is the damage it has done to the public’s perception of the Gov’t, it’s agencies and frankly, science. The fubarred messaging has confirmed biases and cognitive distortions on all sides to the point where everyone is mad/blaming everyone/everything.

I was pleased the Prez said today the vaccine/rollout was a bipartisan effort. That will help us all to maybe say, good job ‘Mericans and stop acting like we know what’s best for everyone, everywhere.

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I agree - the vaccine was as close to a bi-partisan effort (or a non-partisan one, really) as we get these days. It was developed while Trump was president and rolled out under Biden. This should be, IMO, a huge 'win' for America. We developed and implemented a safe and extremely effective vaccine in record time.

I am curious as to how you think that the vaccine could have been messaged differently, though. I thought that the vaccine messaging from the government and medical community was probably the most clear and consistent messaging related to anything COVID. Certainly much more so than the messaging around masks or social distancing. You could argue that the inconsistent messaging throughout kind of 'spread' to the vaccine messaging, I suppose. I think that everyone has been pretty clear - the vaccines are safe and everyone who is eligible should get one.

The messaging on social media and some fringe-news outlets has been much more of a problem, but those are people that are not out for the public good, but rather to drive engagement / clicks, and nothing drives engagement like a conspiracy theory. They don't care if people get sick, they just want them to engage with their platform.

My brother, for example, is not vaccinated because they are 'not done having kids yet' and the vaccine is 'proven' to cause miscarriages. He really can't explain it any further than that. I believe what he is referring to is a 'study' that made the rounds on social media in which something like 20% of the people who got pregnant in a vaccine study miscarried - the same % of pregnancies that naturally end in miscarriage. He is college educated and his wife is a dentist. For some reason they want to believe that the vaccine is harmful, and so it's easy to confirm that bias.

The fact that roughly a third of eligible people are choosing not to get the vax is something of a national tragedy / embarrassment, in my eyes.

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Originally Posted by Muskie in dayton

On a side note, I challenge anyone here to find data on the number of reinfection deaths.

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Therein lies the problem - the lack of transparency from the CDC that has led to increasing amounts of skepticism. and outright blowback right now. The data the CDC reports is maddingly small. They should be providing cases, hospitalizations and death data - on a daily basis - for a minimum of 4 groups of people: fully vaccinated / partially vaccinated / unvaccinated and no prior infection / unvaccinated with prior infection.

They should then provide demographic data for each group, especially age, as well as the presence of comorbidities for hospitalizations and deaths.

This data should also be easily comparable to seasonal flu statistics. It's not.

As it is right now, we are left to speculate, use data from states, anecdotal data in news report, and foreign data.

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Originally Posted by boozehound

My brother, for example, is not vaccinated because they are 'not done having kids yet' and the vaccine is 'proven' to cause miscarriages. He really can't explain it any further than that. I believe what he is referring to is a 'study' that made the rounds on social media in which something like 20% of the people who got pregnant in a vaccine study miscarried - the same % of pregnancies that naturally end in miscarriage. He is college educated and his wife is a dentist. For some reason they want to believe that the vaccine is harmful, and so it's easy to confirm that bias.

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I have the same situation. A brother and his wife who refuse to get the vaccine. Both college educated. As we are in our 70's, it's causing the family a lot of angst.

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Originally Posted by boozehound

I agree - the vaccine was as close to a bi-partisan effort (or a non-partisan one, really) as we get these days. It was developed while Trump was president and rolled out under Biden. This should be, IMO, a huge 'win' for America. We developed and implemented a safe and extremely effective vaccine in record time.

I am curious as to how you think that the vaccine could have been messaged differently, though. I thought that the vaccine messaging from the government and medical community was probably the most clear and consistent messaging related to anything COVID. Certainly much more so than the messaging around masks or social distancing. You could argue that the inconsistent messaging throughout kind of 'spread' to the vaccine messaging, I suppose. I think that everyone has been pretty clear - the vaccines are safe and everyone who is eligible should get one.

The messaging on social media and some fringe-news outlets has been much more of a problem, but those are people that are not out for the public good, but rather to drive engagement / clicks, and nothing drives engagement like a conspiracy theory. They don't care if people get sick, they just want them to engage with their platform.

My brother, for example, is not vaccinated because they are 'not done having kids yet' and the vaccine is 'proven' to cause miscarriages. He really can't explain it any further than that. I believe what he is referring to is a 'study' that made the rounds on social media in which something like 20% of the people who got pregnant in a vaccine study miscarried - the same % of pregnancies that naturally end in miscarriage. He is college educated and his wife is a dentist. For some reason they want to believe that the vaccine is harmful, and so it's easy to confirm that bias.

The fact that roughly a third of eligible people are choosing not to get the vax is something of a national tragedy / embarrassment, in my eyes.

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On messaging. Agree it’s been clear and it’s been mixed in with all the other COVID messages. The big mistake was/is mentioning mandates, passports, re-masking and kids. It seems to have gone from get this, stay healthy to get this and obey or else.

Trying to sort through all the reports and where we seem to be headed:

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I would say the more you dig into the data the more confusing it gets, not less.

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https://talkingpointsmemo.com/edblog...eed-more-blame

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Originally Posted by paulxu

I have the same situation. A brother and his wife who refuse to get the vaccine. Both college educated. As we are in our 70's, it's causing the family a lot of angst.

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Is your brother questioning you about your choice?

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Originally Posted by paulxu

I have the same situation. A brother and his wife who refuse to get the vaccine. Both college educated. As we are in our 70's, it's causing the family a lot of angst.

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What does being college educated have to do with anything when it comes to making personal choices?

Good point.

I wonder if ol' Paul has "a lot of angst" with Biden's open border policy where hundreds, if not thousands of illegals are allowed to walk into our country with covid. Will you condemn that? Are you demanding that your party put an end to this? Or will you try to tell us it's not happening, or that the border patrol turns back covid positive illegals?