Covid-19

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08-21-2021, 05:36 AM
Xville

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Yes, Ville. His post wasn't as condescending as you think.

I'm good with my odds of not being in the 2% since I had COVID, am vaccinated, not old, have low body fat and in shape. I take a higher risk driving every day.

Good for you, you have done everything to mitigate your risk and help your fellow man. There are others who didn’t get vaccinated, are in good shape, young etc, and are intubated right now. Yep, anecdotal but an actual fact. As I’m sure you do, I have a few friends, family, and neighbors who are docs and nurses and They share their experiences. If people choose to rather believe that it’s a government conspiracy or money grab, or a way to control people, and ignore most of the medical and scientific community, fine. However, it’s an ignorant extremist view and spreading that kind of misinformation is dangerous to society. Smartly, private enterprise is stepping up.
08-21-2021, 08:47 AM
Strange Brew

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xville

Good for you, you have done everything to mitigate your risk and help your fellow man. There are others who didn’t get vaccinated, are in good shape, young etc, and are intubated right now. Yep, anecdotal but an actual fact. As I’m sure you do, I have a few friends, family, and neighbors who are docs and nurses and They share their experiences. If people choose to rather believe that it’s a government conspiracy or money grab, or a way to control people, and ignore most of the medical and scientific community, fine. However, it’s an ignorant extremist view and spreading that kind of misinformation is dangerous to society. Smartly, private enterprise is stepping up.

It is good for me. Thanks!

And those who don’t share your concern are neither ignorant or extreme but keep dismissing them. That’ll win em over…
08-21-2021, 09:34 AM
Xville

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

It is good for me. Thanks!

And those who don’t share your concern are neither ignorant or extreme but keep dismissing them. That’ll win em over…

Yes they are, and don’t care about winning em over. Private enterprise is stepping up and will save the ignorant.
08-21-2021, 09:38 AM
Strange Brew

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xville

Yes they are, and don’t care about winning em over. Private enterprise is stepping up and will save the ignorant.

That’s a nice opinion you have. How is private enterprise stepping up?
08-21-2021, 09:41 AM
Xville

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

That’s a nice opinion you have. How is private enterprise stepping up?

Opinion based on actual experts science and the medical community, not extreme zealots like Berenson.

Mandates vaccines. It’s wonderful.
08-21-2021, 09:45 AM
Strange Brew

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xville

Opinion based on actual experts science and the medical community, not extreme zealots like Berenson.

Mandates vaccines. It’s wonderful.

Hmm, so the experts that confirm your views. Ok, got it.

I don’t think firing nurses who opt out of the vax is so wonderful. Especially with all the anecdotal stories I’m seeing of the stresses on medical staffs.

BTW, what is experts science?
08-21-2021, 09:57 AM
bobbiemcgee

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I don’t think firing nurses who opt out of the vax is so wonderful. Especially with all the anecdotal stories I’m seeing of the stresses on medical staffs.

So you would be willing to go into an operating room for a minor procedure with a bunch of unvaxxed nurses? Good luck.
08-21-2021, 10:00 AM
Strange Brew

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobbiemcgee

So you would be willing to go into an operating room for a minor procedure with a bunch of unvaxxed nurses? Good luck.

Absolutely. I’m vaxxed.
08-21-2021, 10:06 AM
Lloyd Braun

The issue mostly lies with the 2.7% of people that are immunocompromised. That is why healthcare systems have never let down the mask requirement for staff. That is also why a vaccine mandate for healthcare workers would be easier to push than other private enterprise who simply don’t want their employees to miss work for something preventable and potentially harmful to other employees. We already have it for the flu vaccine.
08-21-2021, 10:16 AM
Strange Brew

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lloyd Braun

The issue mostly lies with the 2.7% of people that are immunocompromised. That is why healthcare systems have never let down the mask requirement for staff. That is also why a vaccine mandate for healthcare workers would be easier to push than other private enterprise who simply don’t want their employees to miss work for something preventable and potentially harmful to other employees. We already have it for the flu vaccine.

Agree Lloyd. Don’t they normally wear masks with high risk patients? Agree, the mandate for healthcare workers is indeed easier to ask of healthcare workers.
08-21-2021, 10:21 AM
STL_XUfan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

It is good for me. Thanks!

And those who don’t share your concern are neither ignorant or extreme but keep dismissing them. That’ll win em over…

Anyone that claims they have done their research and know better than their doctor, you are never going win over no matter how much information you provide them. It is like arguing with the flat earthers, it is simply a lost cause. The only thing that may "win them over" is someone close in their life suffering a terrible consequence and it becoming real to them, and for their sake, I hope that doesn't happen.

The only people left to get are those that are neutral about the vaccine but are not motivated to go out of their way to get it, and those that are worried that that they might have to take time off work if they have a rough reaction to jab and do not want to miss out on that income. For those people, I think private enterprise vaccine mandates will greatly increase the odds that they get it. I know I am going to a concert next weekend where I will need to show my proof of vaccine. I think the airlines should also start requiring it to fly.
08-21-2021, 10:29 AM
Strange Brew

Quote:

Originally Posted by STL_XUfan

Anyone that claims they have done their research and know better than their doctor, you are never going win over no matter how much information you provide them. It is like arguing with the flat earthers, it is simply a lost cause. The only thing that may "win them over" is someone close in their life suffering a terrible consequence and it becoming real to them, and for their sake, I hope that doesn't happen.

The only people left to get are those that are neutral about the vaccine but are not motivated to go out of their way to get it, and those that are worried that that they might have to take time off work if they have a rough reaction to jab and do not want to miss out on that income. For those people, I think private enterprise vaccine mandates will greatly increase the odds that they get it. I know I am going to a concert next weekend where I will need to show my proof of vaccine. I think the airlines should also start requiring it to fly.

No, the airlines serve the public and can’t refuse service for their bias. Or that’s what we’ve been told about bakers anyway. Airlines must provide reasonable accommodations for the unvaxxed. Perhaps emotional support pangolins will help.
08-21-2021, 10:50 AM
Xville

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Hmm, so the experts that confirm your views. Ok, got it.

I don’t think firing nurses who opt out of the vax is so wonderful. Especially with all the anecdotal stories I’m seeing of the stresses on medical staffs.

BTW, what is experts science?

You know what it is because you got vaxxed. Unless you were mandated to. Don’t be coy.
08-21-2021, 11:10 AM
Strange Brew

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xville

You know what it is because you got vaxxed. Unless you were mandated to. Don’t be coy.

I got vaxxed because I researched it from all points of view and made the decision that was best for me.

Not sure what expert science is. There’s actual science and I get that. But using a qualifier before science shows whatever is referenced to not be science but faith in experts. Experts that you choose to put belief in to save you and others. Sounds much like something practiced on Sundays.
08-21-2021, 11:30 AM
Strange Brew

Article that discusses the science of masking children in schools:

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2021...uncertain.html
08-21-2021, 11:37 AM
XU_Lou

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Article that discusses the science of masking children in schools:

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2021...uncertain.html

SB - I gotta take my hat off to you! Over the last 24 hours you've been like Audie Murphy at the Colmar Pocket! Keep firing!
08-21-2021, 11:39 AM
Xville

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I got vaxxed because I researched it from all points of view and made the decision that was best for me.

Not sure what expert science is. There’s actual science and I get that. But using a qualifier before science shows whatever is referenced to not be science but faith in experts. Experts that you choose to put belief in to save you and others. Sounds much like something practiced on Sundays.

Yes I choose to believe most of the medical and science community. People like Lou choose to believe Alex Berenson and quack rural Indiana doctors who are proven wrong over and over.
08-21-2021, 11:44 AM
Strange Brew

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xville

Yes I choose to believe most of the medical and science community. People like Lou choose to believe Alex Berenson and quack rural Indiana doctors who are proven wrong over and over.

Great. You don’t like Berenson.

And great! It worked for your decision. So why are you posting? To advocate for mandates? To feel really, really super superior good about your decision? Are you not confident in your decision and need to disparage those who make alternative choices? I’d like to know so I don’t make general assumptions about people that confirm inherent bias.
08-21-2021, 11:45 AM
XU_Lou

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xville

Yes I choose to believe most of the medical and science community. People like Lou choose to believe Alex Berenson and quack rural Indiana doctors who are proven wrong over and over.

Note - this little pussy continues to take pot shots at me - even after putting me on ignore....
08-21-2021, 11:53 AM
Strange Brew

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lloyd Braun

I’m sure this will get lost in the shuffle of garbage but I do find this pretty interesting and in line with what I’ve seen in real life.

Despite making up 2.7% of the population, 40 - 44% of breakthrough hospitalizations have been in the immunocompromised. I think it may be a bit lower that that but even so that is why they are recommending a 3rd shot.

Pfizer shot will be fully approved in the next week in all likelihood…

Bumping this as it is helpful and likely got lost.
08-21-2021, 12:36 PM
paulxu

More cowbell!

https://www.cnn.com/2021/08/21/us/mi...rug/index.html
08-21-2021, 01:33 PM
Lloyd Braun

I get at least one request a week for ivermectin instead of monoclonal antibody treatment.

Conversation goes like this:
Me: I am going to refer you for monoclonal antibody treatment, they should be able to get you in 2 hours from now and your risk for hospitalization etc is reduced up to 70%, which is great.
Patient: Is it possible to get ivermectin instead?
08-21-2021, 01:38 PM
Lloyd Braun

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Bumping this as it is helpful and likely got lost.

It’s a small sample size but gives what I think is close to accurate data. Now, I should note that while 2.7% of the population is immunocompromised, it’s definitely less that actually know they are.
08-21-2021, 01:42 PM
Strange Brew

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lloyd Braun

I get at least one request a week for ivermectin instead of monoclonal antibody treatment.

Conversation goes like this:
Me: I am going to refer you for monoclonal antibody treatment, they should be able to get you in 2 hours from now and your risk for hospitalization etc is reduced up to 70%, which is great.
Patient: Is it possible to get ivermectin instead?

Ah, the power of branding. :)
08-21-2021, 01:49 PM
Lloyd Braun

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Ah, the power of branding. :)

Yes, and I’m afraid to say “Regeneron” instead of “monoclonal abs” for the same reason. I really don’t want to have a conversation about Trump/Desantis from either side of the opinion spectrum. Have had people decline treatment simply because it was attached to them unfortunately. If they ask for ivermectin though and I say we have Regeneron instead the success rate of them accepting the Regeneron is 100% FWIW. It’s insane this is even a conversation.
08-21-2021, 01:59 PM
Strange Brew

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lloyd Braun

Yes, and I’m afraid to say “Regeneron” instead of “monoclonal abs” for the same reason. I really don’t want to have a conversation about Trump/Desantis from either side of the opinion spectrum. Have had people decline treatment simply because it was attached to them unfortunately. If they ask for ivermectin though and I say we have Regeneron instead the success rate of them accepting the Regeneron is 100% FWIW. It’s insane this is even a conversation.

Yeah, insane indeed but keep letting people know as no one seems to trust anything right now. Understandable as we’re becoming more like Babel.
08-21-2021, 02:29 PM
GIMMFD

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lloyd Braun

I get at least one request a week for ivermectin instead of monoclonal antibody treatment.

Conversation goes like this:
Me: I am going to refer you for monoclonal antibody treatment, they should be able to get you in 2 hours from now and your risk for hospitalization etc is reduced up to 70%, which is great.
Patient: Is it possible to get ivermectin instead?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lloyd Braun

Yes, and I’m afraid to say “Regeneron” instead of “monoclonal abs” for the same reason. I really don’t want to have a conversation about Trump/Desantis from either side of the opinion spectrum. Have had people decline treatment simply because it was attached to them unfortunately. If they ask for ivermectin though and I say we have Regeneron instead the success rate of them accepting the Regeneron is 100% FWIW. It’s insane this is even a conversation.

The first one is so painful, mabs has been proven to reduce the severity/chances of getting COVID in high-risk populations, never would I ever have thought that Ivermectin would become a household name *sigh*... Granted, mab treatment is very case dependent, I had a friend who's father (extensive past medical history of cancer, older patient, etc.) who got COVID back home, and on the second day of hospitalization they wanted to do the monoclonal antibody treatment (he was breathing room air, had a mild case, was hospitalized mainly because of family prominence and to be safe), and I didn't think it was the best call at the time, he actually unfortunately ended up having a very mild allergic reaction so they stopped transfusion, but was kind of confused why they went ahead with it when confirmed on PCR already, granted this was in March..

The second one, is honestly the worst part of trying to bargain with patients in my opinion lol. I comprehensively tell the entire story and full truth of course, but man, it feels like you have to stretch the truth when knowing what side of the toe to line sometimes. I'm sure it'll get better/easier to maneuver with more experience, but sheesh it's not fun.
08-21-2021, 02:39 PM
Strange Brew

Quote:

Originally Posted by GIMMFD

The first one is so painful, mabs has been proven to reduce the severity/chances of getting COVID in high-risk populations, never would I ever have thought that Ivermectin would become a household name *sigh*... Granted, mab treatment is very case dependent, I had a friend who's father (extensive past medical history of cancer, older patient, etc.) who got COVID back home, and on the second day of hospitalization they wanted to do the monoclonal antibody treatment (he was breathing room air, had a mild case, was hospitalized mainly because of family prominence and to be safe), and I didn't think it was the best call at the time, he actually unfortunately ended up having a very mild allergic reaction so they stopped transfusion, but was kind of confused why they went ahead with it when confirmed on PCR already, granted this was in March..

The second one, is honestly the worst part of trying to bargain with patients in my opinion lol. I comprehensively tell the entire story and full truth of course, but man, it feels like you have to stretch the truth when knowing what side of the toe to line sometimes. I'm sure it'll get better/easier to maneuver with more experience, but sheesh it's not fun.

Thanks to you both. Could you indulge me with a high level PSA on the various treatments? Frankly, lot is out there in the wind and I don’t know what everything actually does.
08-21-2021, 04:12 PM
Xville

Quote:

Originally Posted by XU_Lou

Note - this little pussy continues to take pot shots at me - even after putting me on ignore....

Wahhhhh!!!!!
08-21-2021, 04:13 PM
Xville

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Great. You don’t like Berenson.

And great! It worked for your decision. So why are you posting? To advocate for mandates? To feel really, really super superior good about your decision? Are you not confident in your decision and need to disparage those who make alternative choices? I’d like to know so I don’t make general assumptions about people that confirm inherent bias.

People can make their own choices until it effects everyone else. Thats the problem I have with these morons. Yep everyone should get a vaccine unless there is some medical or religious reason that they cannot
08-21-2021, 04:23 PM
Strange Brew

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xville

People can make their own choices until it effects everyone else. Thats the problem I have with these morons. Yep everyone should get a vaccine unless there is some medical or religious reason that they cannot

You’re vaxxed and cautious. Other people’s choice in the matter has zero affect on you.
08-21-2021, 04:32 PM
Xville

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

You’re vaxxed and cautious. Other people’s choice in the matter has zero affect on you.

Incredibly short sighted. I’m not just talking about me, I’m talking about friends and family who may have procedures delayed, prognosis delayed, heart surgery in the case of my dad delayed because of people’s stupid choices. I’m also talking about health care workers who are stretched to the max including friends and family now having to deal with this bs again.
08-21-2021, 04:37 PM
Strange Brew

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xville

Incredibly short sighted. I’m not just talking about me, I’m talking about friends and family who may have procedures delayed, prognosis delayed, heart surgery in the case of my dad delayed because of people’s stupid choices. I’m also talking about health care workers who are stretched to the max including friends and family now having to deal with this bs again.

Did you just learn that phrase and do you feel it’s effective? Why are procedures delayed if they’re vaxxed?
08-21-2021, 04:53 PM
paulxu

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Did you just learn that phrase and do you feel it’s effective? Why are procedures delayed if they’re vaxxed?

Could it be because hospital beds (especially ICU's) and doctors and nurses are stretched to the max handling Covid cases?
08-21-2021, 05:03 PM
Strange Brew

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulxu

Could it be because hospital beds (especially ICU's) and doctors and nurses are stretched to the max handling Covid cases?

Don’t know. Asked Ville about his personal experience on which I can speculate.
08-21-2021, 05:05 PM
Xville

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulxu

Could it be because hospital beds (especially ICU's) and doctors and nurses are stretched to the max handling Covid cases?

Bingo. In many states and hospitals the population is back to non covid cases being delayed and pushed back. Some people don’t understand ramifications of anything.
08-21-2021, 05:06 PM
xu82

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulxu

Could it be because hospital beds (especially ICU's) and doctors and nurses are stretched to the max handling Covid cases?

As GIMMFD mentioned in post #5688, people at the hospital where he’s working in Orlando are unable to get mastectomies to battle cancer because they are too inundated with Covid patients. I don’t mind getting vaccinated or wearing a mask in some indoor settings for a while if there is a chance it could help those people, but that’s just me.

I took the liberty of a quick copy and paste.

“I'm in Orlando right now, it's a cluster-fuck with COVID patients, went to the ED today for a consult and running max capacity with people being seen in portable beds in the hallways as an "observation" type of unit, I think it's something along the lines of 118/162 beds in the hospital are COVID positive, all elective surgeries (which unfortunately includes procedures like mastectomies for breast cancer) are on hold, they're floating the surgical/anesthesia support staff to different areas to help out any way they can, and there's been some absolute horror stories I've heard in passing, so honestly not surprised, but I do give condolences, it's tough to stomach some of this stuff.”

What more do you need to know?
08-21-2021, 05:17 PM
Strange Brew

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xville

Bingo. In many states and hospitals the population is back to non covid cases being delayed and pushed back. Some people don’t understand ramifications of anything.

I understand completely however I don’t think you do.
08-21-2021, 05:22 PM
xu82

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xville

Bingo. In many states and hospitals the population is back to non covid cases being delayed and pushed back. Some people don’t understand ramifications of anything.

Either they don’t understand, or they are too arrogant and/or selfish to care. It’s hard to say which for sure.
08-21-2021, 05:33 PM
Xville

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I understand completely however I don’t think you do.

Nice pee wee Herman reply

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