Covid-19

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Originally Posted by xubrew

I have a lot of friends that live in Italy and I go over there every summer. Talking to them every day and hearing about how awful things are over there scares the hell out of me. They have healthier people and live healthier lives than we do too. One woman I'm friends with is a doctor. A colleague of hers committed suicide a couple of days ago. She came down with the virus, and after being an emotional wreck trying to help people that had died from it just decided she couldn't take it anymore. I think we are less prepared than they were. I'm am now the complete inverse of where I was three weeks ago when I didn't think it was a big deal.

...but we might be TOTALLY fucked here.

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You might find this informative article interesting as to why Italy has been hit so hard.
They decided to Dance with the Devil. And now they are paying the price.
Most MSM won’t report this because A. They probably consider this “racist”, B. It diminishes their #PandemicPanic narrative.
Trump shutting down flights from China in January was a great thing, although at the time he was called “racist” for doing so then.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.reb...r-or-worse.amp

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Originally Posted by Masterofreality

You might find this informative article interesting as to why Italy has been hit so hard.
They decided to Dance with the Devil. And now they are paying the price.
Most MSM won’t report this because A. They probably consider this “racist”, B. It diminishes their #PandemicPanic narrative.
Trump shutting down flights from China in January was a great thing, although at the time he was called “racist” for doing so then.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.reb...r-or-worse.amp

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Yeah, I've seen it. It explains how it initially got to Italy and why they get hit harder sooner. It offers no guarantees whatsoever that we won't get hit just as hard or harder. In fact, all it does is indicate how quickly it can spread once it gets into a country. Well, it's in our country now. So to dismiss what is happening in Italy because of how it initially got there is kinda stupid.

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Originally Posted by Masterofreality

You might find this informative article interesting as to why Italy has been hit so hard.
They decided to Dance with the Devil. And now they are paying the price.
Most MSM won’t report this because A. They probably consider this “racist”, B. It diminishes their #PandemicPanic narrative.
Trump shutting down flights from China in January was a great thing, although at the time he was called “racist” for doing so then.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.reb...r-or-worse.amp

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Does anyone have a link where any network or person in the MSM called Trump racist for shutting down flights from China? I am not saying it didnt happen but I have heard him and others say this numerous times but when I searched I couldnt find anyone doing so. Again not saying it didnt but if anyone can post a link where it did happen it would be appreciated.

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Originally Posted by D-West & PO-Z

Does anyone have a link where any network or person in the MSM called Trump racist for shutting down flights from China? I am not saying it didnt happen but I have heard him and others say this numerous times but when I searched I couldnt find anyone doing so. Again not saying it didnt but if anyone can post a link where it did happen it would be appreciated.

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Joe Biden for one....

“In January, Biden also criticized as xenophobic the administration’s travel ban to China as the outbreak began to worsen, although it was instrumental in preventing an outbreak in the United States much sooner.

“This is no time for Donald Trump’s record of hysteria and xenophobia,” Biden said during an Iowa campaign event.”

https://thefederalist.com/2020/03/12...egan-in-china/

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Originally Posted by Masterofreality

Joe Biden for one....

“In January, Biden also criticized as xenophobic the administration’s travel ban to China as the outbreak began to worsen, although it was instrumental in preventing an outbreak in the United States much sooner.

“This is no time for Donald Trump’s record of hysteria and xenophobia,” Biden said during an Iowa campaign event.”

https://thefederalist.com/2020/03/12...egan-in-china/

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edit

Sure, but Joe Biden is dead. Haven't you heard?

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Originally Posted by Masterofreality

Joe Biden for one....

“In January, Biden also criticized as xenophobic the administration’s travel ban to China as the outbreak began to worsen, although it was instrumental in preventing an outbreak in the United States much sooner.

“This is no time for Donald Trump’s record of hysteria and xenophobia,” Biden said during an Iowa campaign event.”

https://thefederalist.com/2020/03/12...egan-in-china/

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I don't understand why you would need a travel ban during a Democratic hoax.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5TZ6fTYrsE

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Originally Posted by Masterofreality

Joe Biden for one....

“In January, Biden also criticized as xenophobic the administration’s travel ban to China as the outbreak began to worsen, although it was instrumental in preventing an outbreak in the United States much sooner.

“This is no time for Donald Trump’s record of hysteria and xenophobia,” Biden said during an Iowa campaign event.”

https://thefederalist.com/2020/03/12...egan-in-china/

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Watch the video of Biden’s comments and you will see these comments have nothing to do with banning travel from China and strictly with Trumps leadership during this outbreak in general. Take your brain back and do your own research instead of relying on junk media.

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Originally Posted by GoMuskies

Sure, but Joe Biden is dead. Haven't you heard?

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Before his death, Biden was never a qualified epidemiologist, so lets not dismiss the obvious warnings from scientific experts because of what Joe Biden said. (that comment isn't aimed at you).

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Originally Posted by Lloyd Braun

Watch the video of Biden’s comments and you will see these comments have nothing to do with banning travel from China and strictly with Trumps leadership during this outbreak in general. Take your brain back and do your own research instead of relying on junk media.

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Quote from Biden on the video:
“This is no time for Donald Trump’s record of hysteria and xenophobia, hysterical xenophobia, to uh, and fear mongering,” Biden continued.

That comment was made at an Iowa campaign rally right after the Travel Ban was put into effect.
No credit given for any action taken, just partisan criticism based on “xenophobia”.
Seems pretty clear.
Quit getting your news from Rachel Maddow and MSNBC or Concocted News Network for that matter.

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Originally Posted by Lloyd Braun

Watch the video of Biden’s comments and you will see these comments have nothing to do with banning travel from China and strictly with Trumps leadership during this outbreak in general. Take your brain back and do your own research instead of relying on junk media.

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That may be too much to ask. Good recommendation, though.

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Originally Posted by X-man

That may be too much to ask. Good recommendation, though.

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Uh huh.
And my own research shows that Trumps travel ban occurred on January 31.
The Iowa primary occurred February 3. Biden’s campaign event occurred on 2/1. Right after the travel ban.
But that was “fear mongering” and “xenophobic”, right?

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Originally Posted by Masterofreality

Quote from Biden on the video:
“This is no time for Donald Trump’s record of hysteria and xenophobia, hysterical xenophobia, to uh, and fear mongering,” Biden continued.

That comment was made at an Iowa campaign rally right after the Travel Ban was put into effect.
No credit given for any action taken, just partisan criticism based on “xenophobia”.
Seems pretty clear.
Quit getting your news from Rachel Maddow and MSNBC or Concocted News Network for that matter.

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Nice assumption but I don’t watch the news or any MSM.

Again, you are inferring context of his comments as response to China travel ban and not Trump as our leader during a pandemic in general, which is regurgitated garbage from your garbage media source. And I am not a Biden fan by any means.

Oh man, we are SOOOOOO fucked.

Trump specifically said NBC called him racist after the travel ban. Anyone have a link for that?

I mean I see so many people posting on social media, and Trump himself saying, that he was called racist for that by the media but I havent seen one piece of evidence to back that up.

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Originally Posted by Lloyd Braun

Nice assumption but I don’t watch the news or any MSM.

Again, you are inferring context of his comments as response to China travel ban and not Trump as our leader during a pandemic in general, which is regurgitated garbage from your garbage media source. And I am not a Biden fan by any means.

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Is it your position that Biden was NOT in fact referring to Trump's travel ban? Do you feel that he was referring to Trump in general and the fact he called him Xenophobic had nothing to do with the ban?...which was less than 48 hours old.

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Originally Posted by Smails

Is it your position that Biden was NOT in fact referring to Trump's travel ban? Do you feel that he was referring to Trump in general and the fact he called him Xenophobic had nothing to do with the ban?...which was less than 48 hours old.

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Yes that’s my position. I’m sure you could find multiple instances of Biden calling him a xenophobic even prior to the campaign rally (which also is pertinent). And Biden is not alone in that regard. Calling it the Chinese Virus intentionally is blatant xenophobia, sorry. When directly asked, Biden (and I really do not enjoy defending him) has supported travel bans and distancing.

I'd recommend anyone who can pull up CSPAN and listen to the debate going on in the US Senate over this stimulus.

Calling it the Chinese Virus is stupid.

I'm not going to say that Trump is a racist. I am going to say that he's not an epidemiologist or any sort of a scientist. This isn't something that is only effecting China. It isn't something that's only effecting people that have recently visited China. It isn't something that everyone else other than China was able to contain. There are typically actual epidemiological reasons that viruses and diseases are given the names they're given. To call it the Chinese Virus completely misrepresents what this actually is. It also probably means that he isn't listening to anyone that actually knows what the hell they're talking about. That's INCREDIBLY disturbing.

Most of what happens politically has no direct impact on anyone's life. People may not like how Hillary deleted a bunch of emails, or how Trump attacks Obama, or what was in the Mueller Report, or what wasn't in the Mueller Report, or who was appointed to the Supreme Court, or who wasn't appointed to the Supreme Court, or whatever. The thing is, almost none of that has a huge direct impact on peoples' day to day lives. You still work the same job, have the same doctors, live in the same house, and do the same things you'd be doing anyway.

That's not the case with this. You can't just ignore it. You can't just say it's under control when it isn't. You can't say that we are close to a vaccine when we are not. You can't say that we have medicines to treat it when we don't. You can't say that it's going to be gone in 15 days when it won't be. You can't continue to ignore or downplay this problem and not listen to the people who know what they're talking about. The virus is not Trump's fault at all, but the way he is managing it is making it infinitely worse. He can't keep it from spreading simply by saying that it won't. He can't say that anyone who wants to get a test can get a test and that the tests are wonderful when the tests do not actually exist. He can't get people treatment by saying we have medicines that we think will work when in reality no one is really sure whether they will or won't. He can't make this better in fifteen days by simply saying it's going to be better in fifteen days. Lying about this is not like lying about emails or porn stars. Just saying things won't do anything to mitigate it. If anything, it will actually make it a lot worse.

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Originally Posted by Lloyd Braun

Yes that’s my position. I’m sure you could find multiple instances of Biden calling him a xenophobic even prior to the campaign rally (which also is pertinent). And Biden is not alone in that regard. Calling it the Chinese Virus intentionally is blatant xenophobia, sorry. When directly asked, Biden (and I really do not enjoy defending him) has supported travel bans and distancing.

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I'm of German descent.

Is the "German Measles" racist, or does that only apply to non-white references? I'm not offended.
Or how about the "Spanish Flu"? Is that racist against Spain?
How about 'West Nile Virus"? Is that racist against Egyptians?
How about Ebola and Zika viruses. Is that racist against West Africa or Uganda? Or is it that a Black President can call them that but when a white president refers to the disease source he's "racist" or 'xenophobic"?

This virus originated and was covered up in China. This manufactured controversy is total boolsheet. Period.

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Originally Posted by xubrew

Calling it the Chinese Virus is stupid.

I'm not going to say that Trump is a racist. I am going to say that he's not an epidemiologist or any sort of a scientist. This isn't something that is only effecting China. It isn't something that's only effecting people that have recently visited China. It isn't something that everyone else other than China was able to contain. There are typically actual epidemiological reasons that viruses and diseases are given the names they're given. To call it the Chinese Virus completely misrepresents what this actually is. It also probably means that he isn't listening to anyone that actually knows what the hell they're talking about. That's INCREDIBLY disturbing.

Most of what happens politically has no direct impact on anyone's life. People may not like how Hillary deleted a bunch of emails, or how Trump attacks Obama, or what was in the Mueller Report, or what wasn't in the Mueller Report, or who was appointed to the Supreme Court, or who wasn't appointed to the Supreme Court, or whatever. The thing is, almost none of that has a huge direct impact on peoples' day to day lives. You still work the same job, have the same doctors, live in the same house, and do the same things you'd be doing anyway.

That's not the case with this. You can't just ignore it. You can't just say it's under control when it isn't. You can't say that we are close to a vaccine when we are not. You can't say that we have medicines to treat it when we don't. You can't say that it's going to be gone in 15 days when it won't be. You can't continue to ignore or downplay this problem and not listen to the people who know what they're talking about. The virus is not Trump's fault at all, but the way he is managing it is making it infinitely worse. He can't keep it from spreading simply by saying that it won't. He can't say that anyone who wants to get a test can get a test and that the tests are wonderful when the tests do not actually exist. He can't get people treatment by saying we have medicines that we think will work when in reality no one is really sure whether they will or won't. He can't make this better in fifteen days by simply saying it's going to be better in fifteen days. Lying about this is not like lying about emails or porn stars. Just saying things won't do anything to mitigate it. If anything, it will actually make it a lot worse.

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Might I add petty and childish?

The virus has a name. Grown ups use it.

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Originally Posted by xu82

Might I add petty and childish?

The virus has a name. Grown ups use it.

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That's right: Kung Flu

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Originally Posted by Masterofreality

I'm of German descent.

Is the "German Measles" racist, or does that only apply to non-white references? I'm not offended.
Or how about the "Spanish Flu"? Is that racist against Spain?
How about 'West Nile Virus"? Is that racist against Egyptians?
How about Ebola and Zika viruses. Is that racist against West Africa or Uganda? Or is it that a Black President can call them that but when a white president refers to the disease source he's "racist" or 'xenophobic"?

This virus originated and was covered up in China. This manufactured controversy is total boolsheet. Period.

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To repeat, all of those have actual epidemiological reasons for having the names that they have. I'm not saying Trump is a racist. I'm saying he completely misrepresents what it is when he calls it the Chinese Virus.

One virus that got its name for a reason that wasn't epidemiological was the Spanish Flu. I guess we haven't learned anything from that, which is also rather concerning right now. The Spanish Flu actually started in the United States, most likely in Kansas. It then spread around the world during the War, and continued to spread as soldiers became infected, then went back home and infected everyone else. Everyone ignored it or downplayed it, probably because they didn't want to disrupt morale or the normalcy of life (Geez , sound familiar??). The one country that didn't ignore it was Spain. Their newspapers and media were the only ones that initially reported on it for what it really was. That's how it became known as the Spanish Flu, which was really unfortunate because had it not been dismissed as some sort of innocuous illness that was only impacting Spain then maybe millions less people would have died. So, again, it's STUPID to just call this the Chinese Virus. History may end up actually remembering this as the Trump Virus.

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Originally Posted by Masterofreality

I'm of German descent.

Is the "German Measles" racist, or does that only apply to non-white references? I'm not offended.
Or how about the "Spanish Flu"? Is that racist against Spain?
How about 'West Nile Virus"? Is that racist against Egyptians?
How about Ebola and Zika viruses. Is that racist against West Africa or Uganda? Or is it that a Black President can call them that but when a white president refers to the disease source he's "racist" or 'xenophobic"?

This virus originated and was covered up in China. This manufactured controversy is total boolsheet. Period.

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You really just regurgitate propaganda huh...

Asians have been persecuted because of this virus and the fear it causes. Calling it “Chinese Virus” perpetuates that rhetoric that they are somehow responsible for it. Using an official name of the virus is almost always preferred if there is any chance of harm being done to an individual.

I doubt you were persecuted for German Measles in the past, but if you were, I hope you corrected them to the more proper and common term - Rubella.

People of Asian descent should not be persecuted for this. The Chinese government absolutely should.

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Originally Posted by xubrew

To repeat, all of those have actual epidemiological reasons for having the names that they have. I'm not saying Trump is a racist. I'm saying he completely misrepresents what it is when he calls it the Chinese Virus.

One virus that got its name for a reason that wasn't epidemiological was the Spanish Flu. I guess we haven't learned anything from that, which is also rather concerning right now. The Spanish Flu actually started in the United States, most likely in Kansas. It then spread around the world during the War, and continued to spread as soldiers became infected, then went back home and infected everyone else. Everyone ignored it or downplayed it, probably because they didn't want to disrupt morale or the normalcy of life (Geez , sound familiar??). The one country that didn't ignore it was Spain. Their newspapers and media were the only ones that initially reported on it for what it really was. That's how it became known as the Spanish Flu, which was really unfortunate because had it not been dismissed as some sort of innocuous illness that was only impacting Spain then maybe millions less people would have died. So, again, it's STUPID to just call this the Chinese Virus. History may end up actually remembering this as the Trump Virus.

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Or the "Xi Virus", more appropriately?

Hey, I'm not a medical guy, and so I'm not going to try to argue what "epidemiological" reason there is to call numerous diseases after the geographical area of the world it originated from, uh, like this has been called, but whatever...

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Originally Posted by xubrew

That's not the case with this. You can't just ignore it. You can't just say it's under control when it isn't. You can't say that we are close to a vaccine when we are not. You can't say that we have medicines to treat it when we don't. You can't say that it's going to be gone in 15 days when it won't be. You can't continue to ignore or downplay this problem and not listen to the people who know what they're talking about. The virus is not Trump's fault at all, but the way he is managing it is making it infinitely worse. He can't keep it from spreading simply by saying that it won't. He can't say that anyone who wants to get a test can get a test and that they no one is really sure whether they will or won't. He can't make this better in fifteen days by simply saying it's going to be better in fifteen days. Lying about this is not like lying about emails or porn stars. Just saying things won't do anything to mitigate it. If anything, it will actually make it a lot worse.

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Agreed on this 100%.

The Wuhan Wild Wet Markets Virus

It even alliterates!

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Originally Posted by Lloyd Braun

Yes that’s my position. I’m sure you could find multiple instances of Biden calling him a xenophobic even prior to the campaign rally (which also is pertinent). And Biden is not alone in that regard. Calling it the Chinese Virus intentionally is blatant xenophobia, sorry. When directly asked, Biden (and I really do not enjoy defending him) has supported travel bans and distancing.

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Here's a piece of a tweet that Biden sent out the same day as the speech, but afterward.

“Banning all travel from Europe – or any other part of the world – will not stop it,”

Still think that it was just coincidence and that there's just no way Biden could have been referring to Trump's ban as Xenophobic? Perhaps trying to crank up his base at a rally on the heels of a travel being announced?? Any chance?

There are plenty of ways to continue to tear down our president that don't involve propping up a buffoon like Biden.

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Originally Posted by Lloyd Braun

You really just regurgitate propaganda huh...

Asians have been persecuted because of this virus and the fear it causes. Calling it “Chinese Virus” perpetuates that rhetoric that they are somehow responsible for it. Using an official name of the virus is almost always preferred if there is any chance of harm being done to an individual.

I doubt you were persecuted for German Measles in the past, but if you were, I hope you corrected them to the more proper and common term - Rubella.

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What's propaganda? Those are names of diseases from whatever part of the world they came from. And since when have the Chinese been "persecuted" for the naming of this disease- except, of course , by their own oppressive and disingenuous government that killed the doctor who was trying to put the word out about this mess. The Chinese Government is absolutely responsible for this by their irresponsible behavior. And to make it worse, they tried to blame it on the "US Military" for creating and spreading it
You are on the wrong side of this, Brother, but go right ahead and be snowflake offended over the labling of where a disease originated and was covered up.

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Originally Posted by Masterofreality

Or the "Xi Virus", more appropriately?

Hey, I'm not a medical guy, and so I'm not going to try to argue what "epidemiological" reason there is to call numerous diseases after the geographical area of the world it originated from, uh, like this has been called, but whatever...

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Pandemics typically named after the geographic area that they came from. A lot of epidemics are, but not pandemics. Giving it any sort of a geographic name misrepresents what it is.

Well, again, with the exception of the Spanish Flu, which was named after a geographic area/nation that it actually didn't come from.

I don't understand why people need to call it anything other than what it's actual name is. It's another example of throwing something into the mix that doesn't do anyone any good, and arguably actually does harm. But even if it doesn't, it still sounds stupid. To put it into sports terms, it's like calling insisting that baseball be called "Four Base Cricket" or something like that. It's just dumb to try and call it anything other than what it's actual name is.

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Originally Posted by xubrew

Pandemics typically named after the geographic area that they came from. A lot of epidemics are, but not pandemics. Giving it any sort of a geographic name misrepresents what it is.

Well, again, with the exception of the Spanish Flu, which was named after a geographic area/nation that it actually didn't come from.

I don't understand why people need to call it anything other than what it's actual name is. It's another example of throwing something into the mix that doesn't do anyone any good, and arguably actually does harm. But even if it doesn't, it still sounds stupid. To put it into sports terms, it's like calling insisting that baseball be called "Four Base Cricket" or something like that. It's just dumb to try and call it anything other than what it's actual name is.

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I'm no big fan of the "Orange Haired Narcissist", but I think if you research, you'll find that Trump didn't call it that until the Chinese Ambassador- a representative of the Chinese Government- tried to perpetrate the line of crap that the virus was created and then spread by the US Military, rather than starting in outdoor markets in Wuhan.
Sounds like a "stop this garbage" retort to me.

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Originally Posted by Masterofreality

I'm no big fan of the "Orange Haired Narcissist", but I think if you research, you'll find that Trump didn't call it that until the Chinese Ambassador- a representative of the Chinese Government- tried to perpetrate the line of crap that the virus was created and then spread by the US Military, rather than starting in outdoor markets in Wuhan.
Sounds like a "stop this garbage" retort to me.

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This is how I took it as well.

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Originally Posted by Masterofreality

I'm no big fan of the "Orange Haired Narcissist", but I think if you research, you'll find that Trump didn't call it that until the Chinese Ambassador- a representative of the Chinese Government- tried to perpetrate the line of crap that the virus was created and then spread by the US Military, rather than starting in outdoor markets in Wuhan.
Sounds like a "stop this garbage" retort to me.

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It probably was.

And now he should stop calling it that.

If Trump were to somehow actually get this thing under control in fifteen days, then he'll have my vote.

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Originally Posted by Masterofreality

I'm no big fan of the "Orange Haired Narcissist", but I think if you research, you'll find that Trump didn't call it that until the Chinese Ambassador- a representative of the Chinese Government- tried to perpetrate the line of crap that the virus was created and then spread by the US Military, rather than starting in outdoor markets in Wuhan.
Sounds like a "stop this garbage" retort to me.

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You spend a lot of time on here blowing a guy you're supposedly not a fan of.

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Originally Posted by Mrs. Garrett

You spend a lot of time on here blowing a guy you're supposedly not a fan of.

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You do not have to be a fan of someone’s personality or behavior to like what they want to do as a president and agree with his policies.

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Originally Posted by xavierj

You do not have to be a fan of someone’s personality or behavior to like what they want to do as a president and agree with his policies.

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Thanks J for that very succinct explanation. Amazing that *some* have a hard time understanding that concept.

I hope this thing subsides to a manageable level, and real soon.
Tried to figure out what might happen from the regular flu this year:

Cases: up to 40 million
Needing hospitalization: 500,000 (1.25%)
Deaths: @ 30,000 (75/1000 of 1% of cases; 6% of hospitalizations)

Many of the deaths are for other underlying causes, which flare up in the compromised system the flu creates.
We also have the flu vaccine and naturally built up immunity to fight the flu each year

Current worldwide diagnosed cases of the corona virus: @400,000
Deaths: @17,000 (4.25%)

That rate is astounding to me. If we had just 23 million people contract it we'd have a million potential deaths.
I hope that is way, way out of the realm of possibility; but we have no natural immunity built up, or vaccine at this time.

Hope everyone stays safe.

The flaw in using the diagnosed cases as the denominator for the fatality rate is that number is artificially low as most of those tested were symptomatic. It’s missing all the people who actually had the virus but didn’t seek medical attention or get tested.


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