Politics Thread

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Originally Posted by X-man

Now the WH is limiting news access to their press briefings. Can impeachment be far behind?

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It wasn't a "press briefing" but a press gaggle- basically an informal gathering. Former President Obama barred Fox News from gaggles, but later relented. If the administration thinks that some entity may unfairly spin something said in these gatherings into something that it is not, I can see the concern.

The press has MANY opportunities to have access, including a daily press briefing. Mr. Trump has already been very available to the press. Former President Obama went almost a full year between 2009 and mid 2010 WITHOUT any press conference at all. Somehow, though, the pundit minions didn't really care about that. They were more concerned with covering his back.

The "outrage" over this as a freedom of press issue is comical.

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Originally Posted by Masterofreality

It wasn't a "press briefing" but a press gaggle- basically an informal gathering. Former President Obama barred Fox News from gaggles, but later relented. If the administration thinks that some entity may unfairly spin something said in these gatherings into something that it is not, I can see the concern.

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When? The only thing I could find was a report that they tried to exclude Fox News from an interview with the pay czar Kenneth Feinberg. And guess what happened, the media flipped out, called out Obama on it, and the white house instructed the treasury to allow the interview.

Obama was wrong to deny access to Kenneth Feinberg.
If Obama did deny Fox access to the gaggle, he was wrong.
Trump is wrong by denying access.
The next person sitting at that desk will be wrong if they try to do it.

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Originally Posted by STL_XUfan

When? The only thing I could find was a report that they tried to exclude Fox News from an interview with the pay czar Kenneth Feinberg. And guess what happened, the media flipped out, called out Obama on it, and the white house instructed the treasury to allow the interview.

Obama was wrong to deny access to Kenneth Feinberg.
If Obama did deny Fox access to the gaggle, he was wrong.
Trump is wrong by denying access.
The next person sitting at that desk will be wrong if they try to do it.

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Examples:

https://twitter.com/CuffyMeh/status/835311718691713029

https://twitter.com/AriFleischer/sta...15195580542976

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/email-sh...ost-a-lunatic/

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/01/0....co/EPwnlJYwse

http://thefederalist.com/2015/06/15/...-to-reporters/ (Hillary example)

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Originally Posted by Juice

Examples:

https://twitter.com/CuffyMeh/status/835311718691713029

https://twitter.com/AriFleischer/sta...15195580542976

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/email-sh...ost-a-lunatic/

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/01/0....co/EPwnlJYwse

http://thefederalist.com/2015/06/15/...-to-reporters/ (Hillary example)

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https://twitter.com/mkhammer/status/832359232007729154

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Originally Posted by Juice

Examples:

https://twitter.com/CuffyMeh/status/835311718691713029

https://twitter.com/AriFleischer/sta...15195580542976

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/email-sh...ost-a-lunatic/

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/01/0....co/EPwnlJYwse

http://thefederalist.com/2015/06/15/...-to-reporters/ (Hillary example)

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And Obama was wrong to do it.

And Trump is wrong to do it now. Relying on the "well the other guy did it" argument is childish. The disgusting part is not only are both parties guilty of relying on that argument, it seems like it is their preferred tactic.

I really want someone to put together a quiz that has quotes from 2009 Republicans and 2017 Democrats and you have to tell me which party said it. I am fairly certain it would be impossible to pass.

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Originally Posted by STL_XUfan

And Obama was wrong to do it.

And Trump is wrong to do it now. Relying on the "well the other guy did it" argument is childish. The disgusting part is not only are both parties guilty of relying on that argument, it seems like it is their preferred tactic.

I really want someone to put together a quiz that has quotes from 2009 Republicans and 2017 Democrats and you have to tell me which party said it. I am fairly certain it would be impossible to pass.

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That's literally the only kind of argument Juice will make. You've been warned.

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Originally Posted by Caf

That's literally the only kind of argument Juice will make. You've been warned.

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It's not an argument because I'm not trying to justify what he did. In fact I didn't even bring it up. He asked when else Obama did it so I provided examples.

And the reason I make my "arguments" is to show how hypocritical everyone is being each day when they freak out about something "new" Trump is doing when in fact it's usually something that has been done before. When Trump does it they call him racist, a fascist, or label it an unprecedented power grab when those terms were never used before with prior presidents.

I think Trump has done some good things. He's certainly done some dumb things that I disagree with, but what pisses me off about the last few months is the daily freak out from left wing people who act like the world is ending because Trump did something similar to what Obama did.

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Originally Posted by Juice

It's not an argument because I'm not trying to justify what he did. In fact I didn't even bring it up. He asked when else Obama did it so I provided examples.

And the reason I make my "arguments" is to show how hypocritical everyone is being each day when they freak out about something "new" Trump is doing when in fact it's usually something that has been done before. When Trump does it they call him racist, a fascist, or label it an unprecedented power grab when those terms were never used before with prior presidents.

I think Trump has done some good things. He's certainly done some dumb things that I disagree with, but what pisses me off about the last few months is the daily freak out from left wing people who act like the world is ending because Trump did something similar to what Obama did.

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This particular instance is one where you'll be hard pressed to find many actual hypocrites. Bret Baier, who was specifically targeted by Obama, tweeted this about media exclusion:

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Some at CNN & NYT stood w/FOX News when the Obama admin attacked us & tried 2 exclude us-a WH gaggle should be open to all credentialed orgs

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Pointing out "hypocrisy" the way you do is just lazy. First off, it ignores all nuance in extremely complex and wide ranging topics/ideas. Secondly, it's easy to find hypocrisy among "left wing people" or "right wing people" or "the liberal media". Hypocrisy needs to come from a specific source, messenger, outlet, person, etc.

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Originally Posted by Caf

This particular instance is one where you'll be hard pressed to find many actual hypocrites. Bret Baier, who was specifically targeted by Obama, tweeted this about media exclusion:



Pointing out "hypocrisy" the way you do is just lazy. First off, it ignores all nuance in extremely complex and wide ranging topics/ideas. Secondly, it's easy to find hypocrisy among "left wing people" or "right wing people" or "the liberal media". Hypocrisy needs to come from a specific source, messenger, outlet, person, etc.

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I already said I disagreed with the move.

The difference is that when Obama did it no one called it an "attack on the First Amendment" like they are now, which is a gross exaggeration and also a poor understanding of the First Amendment. People didn't wait outside of the NY Times offices in a show of support. Seriously, who has that much time on their hands where they go and hold a small rally for media members?

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Originally Posted by Juice

I already said I disagreed with the move.

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Where did you post that? Linking tweets that defend Trumps actions based on Obamas previously Republican-condemned actions is laughable. You really only point out hypocrisy on one side so of course it will paint the picture that you are biased.

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The difference is that when Obama did it no one called it an "attack on the First Amendment" like they are now, which is a gross exaggeration and also a poor understanding of the First Amendment. People didn't wait outside of the NY Times offices in a show of support. Seriously, who has that much time on their hands where they go and hold a small rally for media members?

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There's a huge difference between threatening to do something and actually doing it. And then doubling down by stating the media is public enemy #1. Trump cannot ever admit wrong-doing, which is part of a fatalistic flaw.

Do people freak out excessively simply because it's Trump? Probably. But the examples you continue to choose are apples to oranges.