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paulxu
04-02-2013, 06:45 AM
The offseason doesn't start for another week, and it's going to be a long one.
So, it's time to focus on the Red machine. Wall Street Journal shows them as the favorite to win the NL.

Not a particuarly good start to lose in 13, and have Ludwick try a Pete Rose move.
Maybe it'll become an instructional video on why to slide feet first.

Here's a great example of lazy reporting by ESPN:


Hamilton was 0 for 4 with a pair of walks. Albert Pujols also failed to get a hit, leaving the Rangers with nothing out of their power spots.

Maybe our problem was not knowing which team we were facing.

coasterville95
04-02-2013, 07:06 AM
Too many stranded batters and lost opportunities. The bases loaded no outs into a no score inning was particularly frustrting. Frustrated with Jay Bruce, multiple chances to be the hero, and nothing.

I'm just glad I chose LAST year to go to Opening Day. Better weather, the last full Opening Day Parade. (It was cut by nearly a third after last years ran so long folks who opted to watch the whole parade had to dash to the ballpark.) - and a win. That and those 1-1 in 13 innings games, while surely an exhibition of great pitching are plain boring to watch. Opening Day injury isn't a great sign either.

I tend to agree with you that it's going to be a nasty, long off-season, when you consider that not even two weeks after one of the greatest moments in Xavier basketball history (getting tabbed to join the big boys league), the board has turned on Mack, pointing out his deficcienceies and claiming he is on the hot seat, and that Xavier is in a financial crisis. Man, the warm fuzzy boost from good news sure doesn't last long.

GoMuskies
04-02-2013, 07:33 AM
the board has turned on Mack, pointing out his deficcienceies and claiming he is on the hot seat

That's actually one person, and even he says Mack isn't on the hot seat yet. But wrong thread.

DC Muskie
04-02-2013, 08:03 AM
I don't think the "board" has turned on Mack.

I will say we will have plenty to bitch about this off season, while watching your Washington Nationals win the pennant!

UCGRAD4X
04-02-2013, 08:16 AM
Too many stranded batters and lost opportunities. The bases loaded no outs into a no score inning was particularly frustrting. Frustrated with Jay Bruce, multiple chances to be the hero, and nothing.

Jay will wait until they are ahead or behind by four or more runs to hit a solo shot.

GoMuskies
04-02-2013, 08:17 AM
Jay will wait until they are ahead or behind by four or more runs to hit a solo shot.

So Jay Bruce = Adam Dunn?

Fireball
04-02-2013, 09:15 AM
One game.

And, quite honestly, if the Redlegs had to lose someone in their everyday 8, then I would have chosen Ludwick as the guy. I think that a Heisey / Paul / Hannahan split of the playing time, with Super Todd playing some left will be OK until Ludwick gets back.

paulxu
04-02-2013, 08:22 PM
So he not only separated his shoulder, but tore ligaments which will require surgery and be out indefinitely.

Nice.

muskienick
04-02-2013, 08:48 PM
So he not only separated his shoulder, but tore ligaments which will require surgery and be out indefinitely.

Nice.

It's all Chris Mack's and Fr. Graham's fault.

ballyhoohoo
04-03-2013, 06:56 AM
So he not only separated his shoulder, but tore ligaments which will require surgery and be out indefinitely.

Nice.

Did he slide off of one foot?

Porkopolis
04-03-2013, 08:05 AM
So who gets the call today? Tempting to bring up Lutz and see how that power translates.

Michigan Muskie
04-03-2013, 08:09 AM
I think the Reds have all the pop they need sitting on the bench and his name rhymes with Kevin Pleasuraco. Don't get me wrong, I love me some Hanny and he's a wizard behind the plate, but I wouldn't be surprised to see Mes pile up some starts if his bat remains as hot as it was in the desert. Dusty can slide him into the 4 slot to replace Luddy, and the numbers could actually be better.

Xavier Paul and Heisey form a capable platoon duo in LF. I am eager to see what roster move the Reds make, though.

Porkopolis
04-03-2013, 09:59 PM
Mike Scioscia put on his idiot hat and pitched to Votto with an open base. Game over.

muskiefan82
04-03-2013, 10:10 PM
Mike Scioscia put on his idiot hat and pitched to Votto with an open base. Game over.

I was a big fan of that plan.

PM Thor
04-04-2013, 04:29 PM
Taking two out of three vs the Angels is a GREAT start. Next up...the Nats then St. Louis. Wow, right into it I guess.

UCGRAD4X
04-04-2013, 04:59 PM
Taking two out of three vs the Angels is a GREAT start. Next up...the Nats then St. Louis. Wow, right into it I guess.

Fire and Frying Pan come to mind.

As long as their bats stay warm to hot, they should be ok.

Amazing to say such a thing about our Cincinnati Reds.

paulxu
04-04-2013, 05:35 PM
You think DC knows the Nats are in town for the weekend?
Sunday's game with Cueto/Strasburg should be a great game.

DC Muskie
04-04-2013, 07:10 PM
Just came back from the Nats game.

I know.

paulxu
04-05-2013, 08:16 PM
Hah! Homer 2 hits them through 6.
Our shortstop has 5 RBI's from the 7 spot.
Close 'em down Reds!

Porkopolis
04-05-2013, 09:57 PM
That was destruction on a biblical level right there.

Snipe
04-05-2013, 11:48 PM
Sucks about Ludwick, he was one of my favorites. Every time he hits the ball it is multiple bases, or so it seems. He is not a singles hitter.

He bailed us out a lot of times last year and was one with the mojo.

I like the hot start though. We could have won the first game easily. Sucks to not be the only undefeated team.

I like winning though, and I hope this team does just that.

Go Redlegs.

paulxu
04-06-2013, 08:19 AM
It's going to be a great night at the ballpark when a guy named Xavier Paul hits a grand slam.

I approve of that.

Fireball
04-06-2013, 08:24 AM
You think DC knows the Nats are in town for the weekend?
Sunday's game with Cueto/Strasburg should be a great game.

The wife and I are going to that one. It will be our first game of the year. Can't wait!

paulxu
04-06-2013, 03:40 PM
Reds down in the bottom of the 11th. Trying to come back.

Edit: couldn't do it. Rubber game tomorrow.

bobbiemcgee
04-06-2013, 04:32 PM
Rubber game tomorrow.

Will Dez and the hall monitor be there?

Porkopolis
04-06-2013, 06:24 PM
It is beyond ridiculous that Marshall isn't on the DL. No need to have a shorthanded bullpen when there are quality arms in Louisville. J.J. Hoover was not at fault today; he has been overworked in a big way because the Reds are using an 11 man staff.

Juice
04-06-2013, 06:53 PM
It is beyond ridiculous that Marshall isn't on the DL. No need to have a shorthanded bullpen when there are quality arms in Louisville. J.J. Hoover was not at fault today; he has been overworked in a big way because the Reds are using an 11 man staff.

They can backdate Marshall's DL stint too. Just 15 day him, and bring up Arredondo for a week.

Porkopolis
04-06-2013, 06:54 PM
They can backdate Marshall's DL stint too. Just 15 day him, and bring up Arredondo for a week.

Exactly. It makes zero sense to pitch shorthanded.

RealDeal
04-06-2013, 08:17 PM
It is beyond ridiculous that Marshall isn't on the DL. No need to have a shorthanded bullpen when there are quality arms in Louisville. J.J. Hoover was not at fault today; he has been overworked in a big way because the Reds are using an 11 man staff.

Agree. That was a spot for Marshall, if he's not available DL him and get someone else here..

Juice
04-07-2013, 11:38 AM
Exactly. It makes zero sense to pitch shorthanded.

It's even more ridiculous than we thought


Mark Sheldon ‏@m_sheldon 1m
If Marshall did go on DL, he'd be eligible to come off immediately since he last pitched in spring on 3/22 (today would be day 16) #reds

DC Muskie
04-07-2013, 03:37 PM
Nice series. Congrats! See you in a few weeks. Unfortunately I don't think I can make any of the games.

Porkopolis
04-07-2013, 04:13 PM
Great start. I'll take 4-2 against two of the best clubs in the league every single time.

paulxu
04-07-2013, 04:36 PM
Nice.

PM Thor
04-07-2013, 09:30 PM
And don't forget the two losses came in extra innings. This Reds team. That is all.

xfan'17
04-07-2013, 10:12 PM
No trusty in dusty...

paulxu
04-08-2013, 06:46 AM
No trusty in dusty...

The strategy this year is get far enough ahead in each game that no managerial decision making is required.

Always a good day when a Xaiver Paul is in the starting lineup.
On to St Louis for some fried redbird.

BBC 08
04-08-2013, 08:34 AM
You guys ready to be swept?

paulxu
04-08-2013, 09:33 AM
You guys ready to be swept?

Hide the women and children. The Reds are coming.

nuts4xu
04-08-2013, 10:01 AM
You guys ready to be swept?

I hope Champman puts a 101 mph heater in the ear hole of Yadier Molina.

Screw the Cardinals!!

XUOHTX
04-08-2013, 02:39 PM
I hope Champman puts a 101 mph heater in the ear hole of Yadier Molina.

Screw the Cardinals!!

I feel like this needed to be reiterated

GoMuskies
04-08-2013, 02:44 PM
You guys are cruel. I hope Chapman just hits him in the ribs.

BBC 08
04-08-2013, 02:46 PM
For all the talk about class and the Cardinals supposed lack of it, you all asking for a fastball to be put in Yadi's head is pretty funny to me.

drudy23
04-08-2013, 02:56 PM
For all the talk about class and the Cardinals supposed lack of it, you all asking for a fastball to be put in Yadi's head is pretty funny to me.

Is it classless if it's necessary?

PM Thor
04-08-2013, 03:12 PM
I kinda hope the Reds catcher does this...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSq5ez5ce7s

nuts4xu
04-08-2013, 03:28 PM
For all the talk about class and the Cardinals supposed lack of it, you all asking for a fastball to be put in Yadi's head is pretty funny to me.

Class is the most over rated word in sports....

Class shmass, I hate the Cardinals!

coasterville95
04-08-2013, 03:32 PM
I went to the game on Sunday - Go Reds, Sorry DC Muskie. 6-3

Great game, great weather, the Reds have outdone themselves again on concession priices, which I didn't think was possible. $5.75 for a bottled Coke, that's almost a bottled BEER at Cintas. On the upside $5.75 for Coke makes the $7.75 for a draft seem almost reasonable by comparison. Love the fact they have a live organist back, and it was kind of neat in a surreal sense listening to a duo on the Fan Zone stage do the famous "Who's on First?" skit.

Hands down, I think the best eating in the park for the common joe fan is the Red's Smokehouse. I like burgers, I like pulled pork - for the Nationals series the special was a grilled burger topped with pull pork BBQ, topped with BBQ sauce. That and two sides will run you $15, but it was a huge sandwich.

Oh, and I scored a deal on parking - parked at Scripps Center - which has no idea how to run a parking gargage, but that can be good. Sign out front said $10, flag man directed us in, good so far. They collect the money on the way OUT. Yeah, have fun with that at the end of the game. On the plus side - like many downtown garages they have installed those automated coin/bill/credit card operated gates at the exit where you insert your ticket and then either swipe a credit card or start feeding in money. Even though the signs said $10, the exit gate was set for $5. Yup, $5 to park one block from Stadium. SCORE!

BBC 08
04-08-2013, 03:36 PM
Class is the most over rated word in sports....

Class shmass, I hate the Cardinals!

Oh I agree it's overrated but Reds fans love saying that the Cards don't have any.

DC Muskie
04-08-2013, 03:39 PM
What's the beer selection at GAB? I was there about two years ago for a game against the Cubs and can't remember.

We just got Dogfishhead on tap at Nats Park. 60 minute is a tremendous beer. I had about, oh, 400 last Thursday afternoon.

PM Thor
04-08-2013, 03:45 PM
At nearly $10 for a beer, I'm sneaking my own in.

But here's the list of craft beers available at GABP.

http://www.redreporter.com/2013/3/30/4133322/2013-guide-to-craft-beer-at-great-american-ballpark

GoMuskies
04-08-2013, 03:55 PM
Oh I agree it's overrated but Reds fans love saying that the Cards don't have any.

Cards fans have no class, and Bob Huggins has no integrity.

xavierj
04-08-2013, 04:07 PM
Class in sports is for who loses, hand shakes before games and Dayton fans. All pointless. They never say losers are classless.

coasterville95
04-08-2013, 04:21 PM
You have to search GABP for beer. They have it, you just need to look past the 4,192 bud light stands. The UDF stands have a few imports in tall boy cans, there are a few upscale beer stands ever now and then. smokehouse has Leinekugels.

LadyMuskie
04-08-2013, 04:27 PM
Class is the most over rated word in sports....

Class shmass, I hate the Cardinals!

Truth!


Oh I agree it's overrated but Reds fans love saying that the Cards don't have any.

Facts are facts, man. The Cardinals have no class. We Reds fans feel it is our duty to make sure everyone is aware of said fact.


Cards fans have no class, and Bob Huggins has no integrity.


Class in sports is for who loses, hand shakes before games and Dayton fans. All pointless. They never say losers are classless.

Above - are more examples of facts regarding class, the Cardinals, and truth!

BBC 08
04-08-2013, 04:41 PM
So you agree that Cards are winners and therefore better? That's what xavierj's post is saying.

GoMuskies
04-08-2013, 04:42 PM
The Cardinals are certainly winners lately. It's really fu$#ing annoying, too.

PM Thor
04-08-2013, 05:03 PM
Ok, so Choo isn't good in center. But his bat is so good, gotta find a solution there. Maybe he's just having a horrible day.

Porkopolis
04-08-2013, 05:07 PM
Ok, so Choo isn't good in center. But his bat is so good, gotta find a solution there. Maybe he's just having a horrible day.

Those drops have nothing to do with position. He would have dropped them in left or right also. Definitely bizarre.

PM Thor
04-08-2013, 05:15 PM
Maybe not, in either of those positions he "probably" would have had more time to get to the ball. Bizarre is right though. And as I type this, Choo gets on base again. No way would I take him out of the lineup, even if he's questionable at center. (What is Choos natural position)

GoMuskies
04-08-2013, 05:17 PM
If the Reds lose this game, does Latos choke Choo out in the locker room?

STL_XUfan
04-08-2013, 05:28 PM
I hope Champman puts a 101 mph heater in the ear hole of Yadier Molina.

Screw the Cardinals!!

I thought the reds go to was to kick people in the head with metal cleats?

PM Thor
04-08-2013, 05:42 PM
I thought the reds go to was to kick people in the head with metal cleats?

No no no, that's only when they are pinned up against the backstop. Come on man.

Porkopolis
04-08-2013, 06:05 PM
I love this Reds team. They claw for every game.

PM Thor
04-08-2013, 06:17 PM
They turned a "clawing back into the game" into a curbstomp game. Holy cow. Shocking, simply shocking.

FYI. Seeing the dayton fans...errr....the Cardinals fans look so demoralized on their Opening Day is just so heart warming.

MADXSTER
04-08-2013, 06:20 PM
Reds announcer....

"These fans are running out of here like they're giving bags of 20's away in the parking lot"

MADXSTER
04-08-2013, 06:23 PM
In the "On Deck Circle" is the Reds bat boy.

GoMuskies
04-08-2013, 06:23 PM
Heisey's having a rough innning.

That's the only negative I could come up with.

Found another: Geez, you can't leave the bases loaded and expect to win! Squandered opportunity there.

PM Thor
04-08-2013, 06:30 PM
This is going to sound stupid...but I have never seen an inning like that, especially so late in a game.

FYI, Cardinals pitcher Mitchell Boggs has an ERA of 162.00 after today and the Reds have 51 runs in 7 games.

coasterville95
04-08-2013, 06:42 PM
Demoralizing opposing teams fans - always a good feeling when it's a team as deserving as the Cardinals

BBC 08
04-08-2013, 06:46 PM
Oh, so that's what it feels like to be raped.

X-band '01
04-08-2013, 07:13 PM
Thankfully, Brooks Conrad was nowhere to be found today.

Jumpy
04-09-2013, 06:47 AM
You guys ready to be swept?

Man, that's gotta sting just a little. Being spotted 3 runs then getting blown out in the 9th. It almost made me feel bad for the Cards, but then I remember it was the Cardinals and laughed even harder.

Jumpy
04-09-2013, 06:53 AM
Maybe not, in either of those positions he "probably" would have had more time to get to the ball. Bizarre is right though. And as I type this, Choo gets on base again. No way would I take him out of the lineup, even if he's questionable at center. (What is Choos natural position)

Right Field.

paulxu
04-09-2013, 07:00 AM
(What is Choos natural position)

http://api.ning.com/files/99UwZBP11aoWpVFWVONXmFRxRHrYQDdtFp26qPWdZLqOt1EcIO VgQYwft6nqFWkYFFiIzppsmXm4CKndRxnUKq6T4cScQP0j/jimmy_choo_ss09_0.jpg

ammtd34
04-09-2013, 07:30 AM
The Machine Room out in the left field corner has a few crafts on tap, usually rotating. I think they're $.75-$1 less than elsewhere in the park, too. It's worth a visit, especially when it's 100 degrees in the summer.

Kahns Krazy
04-09-2013, 10:44 AM
You guys ready to be swept?

I'm ready. Any idea when it will happen?

Fireball
04-09-2013, 02:59 PM
For all the talk about class and the Cardinals supposed lack of it, you all asking for a fastball to be put in Yadi's head is pretty funny to me.

I don't want the fastball to hit him in the head...just in his neck tattoo.

paulxu
04-09-2013, 09:49 PM
Well this doesn't look good for the Reds.
I blame the manager for not starting Xavier Paul.
When you've got a player who has both Xavier and Paul in their name...you gotta play 'em.

Porkopolis
04-09-2013, 09:53 PM
I have to say I'm amazed by Choo. I loved him in Cleveland but he had been spectacular the first week of the season. And he has shoes with his name on the heel which further enhances his awesomeness.

Juice
04-09-2013, 10:00 PM
Well this doesn't look good for the Reds.
I blame the manager for not starting Xavier Paul.
When you've got a player who has both Xavier and Paul in their name...you gotta play 'em.

I'm pretty sure Dusty is falling in love with Robinson like he did with Taveras and Patterson. He loves speed regardless if it comes with any other baseball skills. The jury is obviously still out on Robinson but his minor league numbers are underwhelming.

DC Muskie
04-10-2013, 07:43 AM
I have to say I'm amazed by Choo. I loved him in Cleveland but he had been spectacular the first week of the season. And he has shoes with his name on the heel which further enhances his awesomeness.

Choo in that stadium for 60-70 games is going to make himself a lot of money.

BBC 08
04-10-2013, 03:11 PM
I'm ready. Any idea when it will happen?

Meant to say lose two of three.

GoMuskies
04-10-2013, 03:16 PM
The Reds scored nine in an inning the other day and left the bases loaded. Don't count them out yet!

BBC 08
04-10-2013, 03:28 PM
Game over. Series win for the Cards.

X-band '01
04-10-2013, 03:50 PM
The past 2 days belong in the F$%&! thread.

BBC 08
04-10-2013, 03:56 PM
As in "F***in' Awesome", right?

XUFan09
04-10-2013, 04:34 PM
As in "F***in' Awesome", right?

That's how I read it too!

paulxu
04-10-2013, 04:40 PM
Game over. Series win for the Cards.

Congrats.
ps. That sucks.

Porkopolis
04-10-2013, 09:24 PM
Nice series, Cards. Now on to Pittsburgh to take out some frustration.

paulxu
04-14-2013, 08:11 AM
This is way too early in the season for the Reds to be trying to break my heart.

gladdenguy
04-14-2013, 05:09 PM
That loss was pathetic

GoMuskies
04-14-2013, 05:16 PM
Wow, I turned if off when it was 5-0. That's awful.

D-West & PO-Z
04-14-2013, 05:20 PM
Nice series, Cards. Now on to Pittsburgh to take out some frustration.

Ouch.

bjf123
04-14-2013, 06:01 PM
At least Votto finally hit one out of the yard.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

X-band '01
04-17-2013, 08:26 PM
Perfect series if you're DC Muskie. Trash about to be swept in Cincinnati.

nuts4xu
04-17-2013, 10:54 PM
I was there to witness the sweep....and it was glorious!!

The Phillies got very old, very fast, and will have a tough time competing for their division.

Bring on the Marlins!!

coasterville95
04-17-2013, 11:03 PM
I was also there for that lovely curb stomping of the Phillies. What a wonderful game.

I even had a Penn Station Philly steak. That and fries are $10 at the ball park, not too terrible considering.

Not many people there considering that both tonight's and last nights tickets were valid. There was some howling but nit too bad.

Again, just watching everything come together was beauteous.

Xavgrad08
04-21-2013, 03:11 PM
Looks like the Reds are going to take 3 out of 4 from the Marlins. Bailey had another solid start. Joey is starting to look like his old self. Choo is having a heck of a year so far. Heisey looks completely lost at the plate .

Juice
04-21-2013, 04:54 PM
Looks like the Reds are going to take 3 out of 4 from the Marlins. Bailey had another solid start. Joey is starting to look like his old self. Choo is having a heck of a year so far. Heisey looks completely lost at the plate .

I think it's been way past time to start playing Xavier Paul in left over Heisey. I think Heisey is a fine bench player because he can play center and left but the Reds have nothing invested in him. There isn't a reason not to play Paul more.

Smooth
04-21-2013, 05:56 PM
I guess I'm a day and a half late with this one, but what the hell..................

What if Cozart did have a broken bone in his hand? Do you bring up Hamilton and have him switch back to short? Other than Izturis, the Reds don't have another shortstop on the 40-man roster. They'd have to make a move to get Hamilton on the 40-man, but Parra may be dumped when Marshall comes back anyway so that would only accelerate that move by a couple days.

Juice
04-21-2013, 06:32 PM
I guess I'm a day and a half late with this one, but what the hell..................

What if Cozart did have a broken bone in his hand? Do you bring up Hamilton and have him switch back to short? Other than Izturis, the Reds don't have another shortstop on the 40-man roster. They'd have to make a move to get Hamilton on the 40-man, but Parra may be dumped when Marshall comes back anyway so that would only accelerate that move by a couple days.

Hamilton was bad at short in the minors. There is no way in hell he can handle it at the major leagues, especially after not playing it in awhile. Their options at SS in Louisville do suck though.

usfldan
04-21-2013, 08:31 PM
Hamilton was bad at short in the minors. There is no way in hell he can handle it at the major leagues, especially after not playing it in awhile. Their options at SS in Louisville do suck though.

Manny Burriss and Jason Donald have at least played shortstop in the majors. Moving Hamilton back to short just to fill a short-term need would be very... short-sided. Cozart is the Reds shortstop for the next several years. Keep Hamilton on track to be the Reds centerfielder over that same time.

paulxu
04-21-2013, 09:15 PM
I think it's been way past time to start playing Xavier Paul

I approve of this message.

nuts4xu
04-22-2013, 10:37 AM
It would be great if the Reds could find their left fielder in house, but I am not sure we have someone in the system that is close enough to be ready. I am hoping Xavier Paul platoons with Heisey, as I think Heisey struggles with the pressure of being the everyday LF. If Paul can produce and take some of the pressure of Heisey, these 2 can hold down the position just fine while Ludwick heals.

Our best catching prospect in the organization is in Double A which is why old man Corky Miller had to be called up for Hanigan. Mesoraco should be ready to take over on an everyday basis. I hope he takes advantage of this opportunity. With Mesoraco and Hanigan, we have a very solid catching tandem.

Now with Cozart nursing the finger injuries, I don't like the idea of Izturis playing much more than spot fill in duty. I hope Zach is back sooner rather than later. But with the Cubs coming in, there is no reason to push anyone to play sooner than they are ready. Dusty said Cozart could have pinch hit yesterday, I am hoping he is just bruised and needs a day or two to feel right.

GetUp5
04-22-2013, 11:51 AM
I guess I'm a day and a half late with this one, but what the hell..................

What if Cozart did have a broken bone in his hand? Do you bring up Hamilton and have him switch back to short? Other than Izturis, the Reds don't have another shortstop on the 40-man roster. They'd have to make a move to get Hamilton on the 40-man, but Parra may be dumped when Marshall comes back anyway so that would only accelerate that move by a couple days.

No, Hamilton wouldn't even come up if Choo got hurt. He's not ready.

Parra isn't going anywhere. He's making a mil and that's guaranteed money. Ondrusek gets optioned when Marshall is ready.

GetUp5
04-22-2013, 11:53 AM
Manny Burriss and Jason Donald have at least played shortstop in the majors. Moving Hamilton back to short just to fill a short-term need would be very... short-sided. Cozart is the Reds shortstop for the next several years. Keep Hamilton on track to be the Reds centerfielder over that same time.

Neither are on the 40-man. You'd have to DFA someone to bring them up. Neither are a big enough upgrade over Izturis to justify dumping someone from the 40 man.

nuts4xu
04-22-2013, 04:30 PM
Ondrusek gets optioned when Marshall is ready.

You think Hoover will stick over Ondrusek? Why, because of options? Just curious.

Juice
04-22-2013, 04:33 PM
You think Hoover will stick over Ondrusek? Why, because of options? Just curious.

He's better

GetUp5
04-22-2013, 11:53 PM
You think Hoover will stick over Ondrusek? Why, because of options? Just curious.

Both Hoover and Ondrusek have 'option years' left. They can be 'optioned' at will but have to spend 10 days in the minors when they are. If they're brought up before they've spent 20 days in the minors, they get ML service time credit for the total amount of time they spent in the minors which is a whole different story when you're dealing with pre-arbitration guys.

I don't think enough has happened since ST that would make Walt or Dusty think Ondrusek is all the sudden better than Hoover.

With all these extra inning games and lack of off days, I guess you could always option Robinson down when Marshall is ready and carry 13 pitchers?

Probably just a straight Ondrusek for Marshall though.

Incredible win tonight. This team is 12-8 and Ludwick, Marshall, Cueto and Hanigan are on the DL.

Kahns Krazy
04-23-2013, 12:02 PM
I was ready to turn the game off last night after Frazier did his best croquet wicket impression and Valbuena launched one. I just didn't get around to it, so the TV was still on when BP flared one for a double. Exciting win after a not exciting game to watch. Go Reds.

The reds are leading the league with 9.45 innings pitched per game, which is even more remarkable given their terrible road record.

paulxu
04-23-2013, 01:31 PM
Good things happen when you insert xpaul into the lineup.
Even if you wait until the 13th inning.
Maybe you should try it a little sooner.

BBC 08
04-23-2013, 10:03 PM
Woohoo! Back in first.

xu95
04-24-2013, 11:24 AM
Woohoo! Back in first.

GD Nats.

DC Muskie
04-24-2013, 11:36 AM
GD Nats.

Sorry.

xu95
04-25-2013, 11:04 AM
Sorry.

At this point, please make sure you lose 4 more times in a row.

DC Muskie
04-25-2013, 08:40 PM
Whoops.

RealDeal
04-25-2013, 08:45 PM
That game was over very early.

nuts4xu
04-25-2013, 10:36 PM
Arroyo is prone to a few blow ups each year. Let's hope this is one of only a few, and that he spreads them out well in the next few months.

xu95
04-26-2013, 11:13 AM
GD Nats.

GD Nats.

DC Muskie
04-26-2013, 12:50 PM
GD Nats.

Sorry.

paulxu
04-27-2013, 06:25 AM
Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.
So we are one hit in back-to-back games for the first time since 1900?
What the hell is going on in Cincinnati?
At least they had enough sense to start xpaul to keep it from being a no-hitter.
Gnats are killing us.

XUOWNSUC
04-27-2013, 06:50 AM
GD Nats.

Reds are 1-7 on the road - they are on pace for 10-71 on the road for the year. Gotta think that will change. Worst ever record on the road was 17-64 by the Mets in the 60's I believe...

JAPER
04-28-2013, 05:59 AM
Japer and jr going to game today ownsuc. We'll try to bring home the W.

Xavgrad08
04-28-2013, 04:26 PM
Cingrani has looked pretty good in his starts this year. It has been a long time since the Reds have had a solid left handed starter.

XUOWNSUC
04-28-2013, 04:44 PM
Japer & Japer Jr. - way to bring home the W!

X-band '01
04-28-2013, 10:21 PM
Cingrani has looked pretty good in his starts this year. It has been a long time since the Reds have had a solid left handed starter.

I'm going to go out on a limb and guess it wasn't Eric Milton.

nuts4xu
04-28-2013, 11:24 PM
I'm going to go out on a limb and guess it wasn't Eric Milton.

Big limb there band man....

paulxu
04-29-2013, 09:13 PM
I decided to take a break from reading the Coming Out back and forth...to focus on something different.

This could be a good night. Gnats already lost, Milwaukee is handling the pesky Pirates....and we're leading over the Cards in the 6th.

Good things happen when you start xpaul.

waggy
04-29-2013, 09:24 PM
Good things happen when you start xpaul.

Testify!

nkymuskie
04-29-2013, 09:38 PM
Votto high socks or no? They seem to be working over the past couple games

XU 87
04-29-2013, 10:11 PM
Reds win! Reds win! Reds win!

xu95
04-30-2013, 07:52 AM
Have I mentioned lately that I hate the Cards?

UCGRAD4X
04-30-2013, 10:57 AM
Have I mentioned lately that I hate the Cards?

It both goes without saying and bears repeating...just because.

XU 87
04-30-2013, 08:49 PM
Cozart is not a good #2 hitter. They just said on the air that he has 4 walks this year. He needs to learn how to take some pitches, get some walks and get on base.

paulxu
04-30-2013, 10:16 PM
What is so hard about this. Last night they start xpaul...and win.
Tonight they don't start xpaul...and lose.
Try to figure this out people.

paulxu
05-03-2013, 11:00 PM
OK, one more time.
Earth to Dusty...come in Dusty?

You start xpaul in the first game against the Cards. You win.
You don't start him in the next two games. You lose.
You start him in the first game against the Cubs. You win.

Pretty simple, huh? You got it figured out for tomorrow now?
Good.

paulxu
05-04-2013, 04:27 PM
Respect the streak.

paulxu
05-06-2013, 10:53 PM
What the hell is going on there in Cincinnati?
He starts xpaul a few games in a row...we win the games.
Braves come to town and he doesn't start him???????????????????????????
And I gotta listen to all the Braves fans here give me crap.

Would one of you guys in Cincinnati please explain this to Dusty? Please?
I'm dying here.....

PM Thor
05-06-2013, 10:58 PM
How many blown calls tonight by the umps? Jeez, the Choo stolen base with the mystery tag between the legs, Mesaraco throwing the guy out at second by a wiiide margin, and the trap in the outfield...goodness.

GetUp5
05-07-2013, 01:40 AM
What the hell is going on there in Cincinnati?
He starts xpaul a few games in a row...we win the games.
Braves come to town and he doesn't start him???????????????????????????
And I gotta listen to all the Braves fans here give me crap.

Would one of you guys in Cincinnati please explain this to Dusty? Please?
I'm dying here.....

Since Dusty already knows, I'll explain this to you..

Xavier Paul career vs. RHP: .276
Xavier Paul career vs. LHP: .143

He will NOT play against lefties. Especially tough lefties. There is no way in hell he should be in the lineup vs. Jaime or vs. Maholm.

GetUp5
05-07-2013, 01:45 AM
On another note, I find it legitimately mind boggling that people have the gall to question what a major league manager does. Especially when you don't even know simple concepts like platooning, LHP/RHP splits, etc.. how do you think you really know more than him? Does anyone realize how much baseball Dusty Baker has played/coached in his life?

I was at the ballpark tonight and all I heard were people yelling at Dusty after Arroyo and Ondrusek gave up homeruns. Is Dusty supposed to manage and play? What did Dusty do wrong when Arroyo, the starter, gave up a homerun? I'm from Cincinnati and always have and always will be a Reds fan, but we sure do have a terribly, terribly uneducated fan base when it comes to the game of baseball.

Rant over.

paulxu
05-07-2013, 05:26 AM
Respect the streak.
Then again..we can have a new streak where we lose against all LHP.

(NB: lighten up; I'm having a little fun with the guy's name. Although respecting a streak is a time-honored tradition...in the South.)

paulxu
05-07-2013, 11:51 AM
Fun statistical note: the last time XPaul started against a left-handed pitcher was Ross Detwiler of the Gnats on April 28th.

Before last night's game we had won 5 in a row...he started all 5 of them...until last night.

I'll leave it to the managerial geniuses to guess what the outcome of our game was when he started against the left hander Detwiler.

ammtd34
05-07-2013, 12:45 PM
How many blown calls tonight by the umps? Jeez, the Choo stolen base with the mystery tag between the legs, Mesaraco throwing the guy out at second by a wiiide margin, and the trap in the outfield...goodness.

No kidding. I'll even concede the trap since I couldn't tell when I saw it live. The two at second base were ridiculous. Apparently doing a barrel roll constitutes a tag and dragging BOTH feet on the bag with the ball in your glove doesn't constitute a force.

paulxu
05-07-2013, 07:08 PM
I'm guessing that 41 pitches in the first inning is not a good thing.

GetUp5
05-07-2013, 07:39 PM
Fun statistical note: the last time XPaul started against a left-handed pitcher was Ross Detwiler of the Gnats on April 28th.

Before last night's game we had won 5 in a row...he started all 5 of them...until last night.

I'll leave it to the managerial geniuses to guess what the outcome of our game was when he started against the left hander Detwiler.

I'm guessing you're saying that XP has started the last 5 Reds wins. They certainly did not win 5 in a row.
His 1 for 4 with an infield single vs. Detwiler was definitely the reason the Reds won that game.

KC4X
05-07-2013, 08:23 PM
I'm guessing you're saying that XP has started the last 5 Reds wins. They certainly did not win 5 in a row.
His 1 for 4 with an infield single vs. Detwiler was definitely the reason the Reds won that game.

Lighten up, Francis! Paul is having some fun with the name Xavier Paul (Paulxu... get it?) Geez; are you related to Dusty or something?

paulxu
05-07-2013, 09:51 PM
I'm guessing you're saying that XP has started the last 5 Reds wins.

Now 6. Respect the streak!

Nigel Tufnel
05-08-2013, 06:41 PM
Bottom of 7th, 2-1 Braves, 2 men on, Leake sitting on 96 pitches....and Dusty lets him hit? Seriously? Then he goes out in the 8th and immediately the Braves get multiple runners on base...and you know the rest of the story. I realize the pen has been used a lot lately...but, come on.

Juice
05-08-2013, 07:03 PM
Bottom of 7th, 2-1 Braves, 2 men on, Leake sitting on 96 pitches....and Dusty lets him hit? Seriously? Then he goes out in the 8th and immediately the Braves get multiple runners on base...and you know the rest of the story. I realize the pen has been used a lot lately...but, come on.

Guess who had not been used since Saturday? Chapman.

What would happen if Dusty, or any manager for that matter, used a closer in a spot that wasn't the 9th or with a lead 3 runs or less in the last inning? Would that pitcher then die instantly?

Nigel Tufnel
05-31-2013, 09:41 PM
Nice win tonight against the Pirates. Cueto looked great. And, man, I love me some Sam Lecure. The guy doesn't have anything overpowering, but he just grinds. And has Tu Holloway like nads. I knew he was good last year, but what he did in Game 1 in San Fran after Cueto went out was nothing short of amazing. And this year, the guy has been awesome. 1.27 ERA in 22 innings. Anyone know the status of his contract? If its up at the end of this year...dude is getting some coin from someone.

usfldan
05-31-2013, 10:27 PM
According to baseball-reference.com (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/l/lecursa01.shtml#contracts), LeCure becomes arbitration eligible next season and won't be a free agent until 2017.

Nigel Tufnel
05-31-2013, 11:48 PM
According to baseball-reference.com (http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/l/lecursa01.shtml#contracts), LeCure becomes arbitration eligible next season and won't be a free agent until 2017.

Thanks for the time and the site. I can do my own homework from here on out. Nice to have him inked for a couple of years...right now, he's one of the best at his role in baseball.

Kahns Krazy
06-02-2013, 09:21 PM
Are the Reds hitting the clubs Saturday night? This is the second straight Sunday they have blown a game late to a sub-par team.

mohr5150
06-02-2013, 09:44 PM
Broxton is the problem. He sucks ass.

ammtd34
06-03-2013, 07:10 AM
Broxton is the problem. He sucks ass.

Two outs in the 8th with a left handed batter coming to the plate, and the Reds don't bring in Chapman? God forbid he has to pitch four outs.

mohr5150
06-03-2013, 07:28 AM
Broxton is being paid a crazy amount of money because he was supposed to be our closer. If he can't get a left handed batter out, let alone not give up a 500 foot home run, then why in the hell is he getting paid so much money? I have liked most of the moves made by the Reds over the past several years, but the move to sign Broxton was stupid as hell. He sucks, has always sucked, and now we are stuck with him for three years unless some team in contention is dumb enough to want him at the trade deadline.

paulxu
06-08-2013, 08:40 PM
If you want to win this division, you have to beat the damn Cardinals.
Come on Reds. Let's get one anyway.

paulxu
06-09-2013, 07:05 PM
Let's go Reds!

bleedXblue
06-10-2013, 07:32 AM
Reds need to get healthy and stay healthy to have a chance to beat the Cards.

I see the remaining issues :

1. Need a solid 2 hole hitter. Cozart is not it.
2. A more aggressive Votto at the plate.
3. Bullpen needs to step it up

DC Muskie
06-10-2013, 07:36 AM
I really, really hate the Cardinals.

Juice
06-10-2013, 07:43 AM
Reds need to get healthy and stay healthy to have a chance to beat the Cards.

I see the remaining issues :

1. Need a solid 2 hole hitter. Cozart is not it.
2. A more aggressive Votto at the plate.
3. Bullpen needs to step it up

If Hanigan was hitting/getting on base like last year then I think he might be ok in the 2 hole. But I would bat either Paul or Robinson there. They aren't the long term answer but they are definitely an improvement over Cozart.

And bunting with your #2 hitter in the first inning to move a guy over is so so dumb it makes my head hurt. Giving away outs annoys me.

ammtd34
06-10-2013, 08:51 AM
The bullpen is in major crisis mode.

nuts4xu
06-10-2013, 09:39 AM
I really, really hate the Cardinals.

Hate the Cardinals, HATE em. Hate em almost as much as blowing leads late in games!

mohr5150
06-10-2013, 10:27 AM
Can someone tell me the strategy the Reds pitchers have against Molina? He is a notorious first-pitch swinger, and our pitchers time and time again try to throw a get-ahead fastball against him and he is raking against us like nobody's business. Is there anyone else out there who believes a couple of high-and-tight fastballs are in order? Other than Cueto, I believe our staff is a bunch of wusses who won't pitch inside. The Cardinals know this, and tee off accordingly. I also don't understand at all their strategy once they get ahead. I don't know how many times I've seen this staff get burned badly on 0-2 or 1-2 pitches. These are basic understandings of pitching that are getting thrown out the window by this staff right now, but can be fixed. Our lineup is our lineup, so we are stuck with horrible hitters like Cozart.

Fireball
06-13-2013, 09:35 AM
The Cubs are the cure for what ails ya!

bleedXblue
06-13-2013, 10:33 AM
I don't see the Cardinals keeping up this pace the rest of the way. I see a very close race come late August. I still don't think we have the team to win it all. Even with an improved bullpen ( i think they will get better) the middle of the lineup for the Reds is simply not good enough. Complacent Joey Walko and an inconsistent Bruce are not going to get us there IMHO.

XU 87
06-13-2013, 11:18 AM
I don't understand you calling Voto "complacent". I know he's walking a lot. But do you want him to start swinging at bad pitches? Marty seemed to say as much on the air the other day and I think that's a bad suggestion to swing at pitches outside the strike zone. One reason Phillips has so many RBI's is Votto has about a.440 OBP, which leads the league. Votto is also second in the league in runs scored.

nuts4xu
06-13-2013, 11:48 AM
Votto has had a tough go of it driving in runs, but that is because he hasn't had many people on base to drive in! Choo has cooled off, and Cozart has been terrible. It was nice to see Dusty try something different yesterday with Robinson leading off, but he has Cozart back in the 2 hole again this afternoon.

Votto has been fine, and has very good numbers. He will continue to hit well, take walks, and when possible...drive in runs. I don't see him as complacent at all, and not sure why someone would refer to him as such.

Juice
06-13-2013, 12:24 PM
I don't see the Cardinals keeping up this pace the rest of the way. I see a very close race come late August. I still don't think we have the team to win it all. Even with an improved bullpen ( i think they will get better) the middle of the lineup for the Reds is simply not good enough. Complacent Joey Walko and an inconsistent Bruce are not going to get us there IMHO.

Jesus, you're one of those people who thinks walking is a bad thing? You've been listening to that tard Thom Brenamman too much.

Votto is 10th-12th in WAR and 5th in runs created. He is also 8th in OPS.

XU 87
06-13-2013, 12:48 PM
Marty said on the air that Votto wasn't "getting paid to walk" and that he "needs to expand his strike zone when men are on base". I thought that was a really foolish statement. Are you really recommending that he swing at bad pitches?

And I also agree that walks (getting on base) are a good thing.

ammtd34
06-13-2013, 01:11 PM
Marty said on the air that Votto wasn't "getting paid to walk" and that he "needs to expand his strike zone when men are on base". I thought that was a really foolish statement. Are you really recommending that he swing at bad pitches?

And I also agree that walks (getting on base) are a good thing.

I agree. I would also add that Votto has made some ridiculous plays at first base in the last couple of weeks.

XUOWNSUC
06-13-2013, 06:36 PM
Damn Broxton (and LeCure). Our bullpen sucks right now. Gave another one away. Streak at Wrigley ends at 12. I'm gonna see the Reds in person tomorrow night.

XU Cowbell Kid
06-13-2013, 07:15 PM
Crazy stat about Votto that I like to think is a testament to his great selectivity... since Votto entered the MLB, there have been more perfect games pitched (13 or 14, depending if you want to count Galarraga's) than Joey Votto infield fly balls (11). That is an absolutely incredible stat. He has hit one infield fly ball in the past three seasons combined. This is an absolutely outrageous stat, and the point is, when Votto decides to swing, he swings at good pitches that he can always get a hold of. If he starts swinging at pitches a little up in the zone, that number will go way up. And to give you an idea how crazy that stat is, a relatively similar line drive hitter like Matt Holliday of the Cardinals has already hit 17 infield fly balls... this season.

Did I mention it's an insane stat?

mohr5150
06-13-2013, 07:23 PM
Broxton is the biggest waste of money in MLB. He brings no quality to this team. I hope they trade his ass at the trade deadline to the schmuck of a team that will take him.

Juice
06-13-2013, 11:51 PM
Broxton is the biggest waste of money in MLB. He brings no quality to this team. I hope they trade his ass at the trade deadline to the schmuck of a team that will take him.

That contract is horrible. How Jocketty didn't see that Broxton would regress makes me doubt his intelligence.

ammtd34
06-14-2013, 05:21 AM
God forbid Chapman comes in with 2 outs in the 8th when it was apparent that Lecure was getting smacked all over the place. He had already been throwing.

nuts4xu
06-14-2013, 09:34 AM
Broxton is the biggest waste of money in MLB. He brings no quality to this team. I hope they trade his ass at the trade deadline to the schmuck of a team that will take him.

I don't know why they waited so long to use Broxton. I am assuming he was kind of hurt, since he hadn't pitched since Sunday. If he was still hurt, they shouldn't have used him....he was certainly not himself yesterday.

casualfan
06-14-2013, 09:52 AM
I don't know why they waited so long to use Broxton. I am assuming he was kind of hurt, since he hadn't pitched since Sunday. If he was still hurt, they shouldn't have used him....he was certainly not himself yesterday.


He was sore and they were trying to avoid using him if at all possible.

All the posts about the bullpen are dead on. We need some guys to sack up and start performing. That is the downside. The upside is that bull;pen is the easiest thing to fix at the deadline. There will be plenty of middle relief to be had and you know Walt will be a mover and a shaker.

The biggest key IMO is getting Marshall back. His absence has hurt this team more than anyone else IMO because it forces other guys into roles they aren't comfortable with. I will say the signing of Duke makes me nervous that something more serious is wrong with Marshall.

nuts4xu
06-14-2013, 10:11 AM
I will say the signing of Duke makes me nervous that something more serious is wrong with Marshall.

I agree. Marshall dealt with shoulder tendinitis at the beginning of the season, and now the shoulder is "sprained'. They need to get that shoulder healthy, and ready for a pennant race. Tendinitis can be something that lingers with a person for months. It also could be an indication there is something else happening in that joint. I suspect the sprain is more of a flare up of the tendinitis he was working through at the start of the season.

Either way, we really need him at 100%. Zach Duke isn't a long term answer, but we are desperate for LHP's right now.

Juice
06-14-2013, 11:43 AM
I agree. Marshall dealt with shoulder tendinitis at the beginning of the season, and now the shoulder is "sprained'. They need to get that shoulder healthy, and ready for a pennant race. Tendinitis can be something that lingers with a person for months. It also could be an indication there is something else happening in that joint. I suspect the sprain is more of a flare up of the tendinitis he was working through at the start of the season.

Either way, we really need him at 100%. Zach Duke isn't a long term answer, but we are desperate for LHP's right now.

I know of a pretty good lefty reliever with a pretty fresh arm who is available to use at any time...

chico
06-14-2013, 01:03 PM
Jesus, you're one of those people who thinks walking is a bad thing?

Maybe he's thinking of softball, although some on this site would disagree with that.

There has to be a better option than Duke - or Manny Parra. There has to be a team willing to trade a lefty reliever for some middle of the road AA prospect. Maybe Dunn from the Marlins.

bleedXblue
06-14-2013, 04:22 PM
Crazy stat about Votto that I like to think is a testament to his great selectivity... since Votto entered the MLB, there have been more perfect games pitched (13 or 14, depending if you want to count Galarraga's) than Joey Votto infield fly balls (11). That is an absolutely incredible stat. He has hit one infield fly ball in the past three seasons combined. This is an absolutely outrageous stat, and the point is, when Votto decides to swing, he swings at good pitches that he can always get a hold of. If he starts swinging at pitches a little up in the zone, that number will go way up. And to give you an idea how crazy that stat is, a relatively similar line drive hitter like Matt Holliday of the Cardinals has already hit 17 infield fly balls... this season.

Did I mention it's an insane stat?

Votto is paid to hit the damn ball. I'll take 30 pop ups a year if it means he's going to hit 30 homers and driver in 120 runs. The pace he's on now is a joke for the amount of money the Reds are paying him.

XUOWNSUC
06-14-2013, 04:28 PM
Of course, the night I go to the Reds game, Votto is out of the line-up. Glad the Cubs fans got to see him yesterday, but Reds fans won't get to see him today.

Juice
06-14-2013, 06:15 PM
Votto is paid to hit the damn ball. I'll take 30 pop ups a year if it means he's going to hit 30 homers and driver in 120 runs. The pace he's on now is a joke for the amount of money the Reds we paying him.

You're looking at counting stats. Don't do that. That's dumb. Look at splits or value stats.

XUFan09
06-14-2013, 08:01 PM
You're looking at counting stats. Don't do that. That's dumb. Look at splits or value stats.

Pretty much. Or, do focus on counting stats and then somehow convince Reds management to change the batting strategy for Votto. Being a Cardinals fan, I'd love it if my team's main divisional opponent shot themselves in the foot.

Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk 2

chico
06-14-2013, 09:32 PM
Votto is paid to hit the damn ball. I'll take 30 pop ups a year if it means he's going to hit 30 homers and driver in 120 runs. The pace he's on now is a joke for the amount of money the Reds are paying him.

Read this. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/joey-votto-on-hitting/

XU 87
06-14-2013, 10:49 PM
Votto is paid to hit the damn ball. I'll take 30 pop ups a year if it means he's going to hit 30 homers and driver in 120 runs. The pace he's on now is a joke for the amount of money the Reds are paying him.

So you want him to swing at bad pitches?

bleedXblue
06-15-2013, 07:40 AM
Votto is a great hitter. You can reference stats, articles, whatever anyone wants. I never said he wasnt a great hitter. I simply want him to be more aggressive at the plate and look to drive in runs when given the opportunity. Does that mean he should swing at some marginal pitches when the counts in his favor ? IMHO, yes he should. He's that good. He's being overly selective in situations where the Reds need his bat.

You guys are dismissing Marty's opinion as well ? That's hilarious. He's watched more baseball than some of you have been alive. He's a Hall of Famer. Some of you guys are.......funny.

XU 87
06-15-2013, 08:42 AM
And what Marty said was stupid. To criticize a player for not swinging at pitches outside the strike zone is really, really bad advice. If Votto isn't getting good pitches to hit, then don't swing at them.

He has 11 hr's, so he's hitting with some power. He's also leading the lead in OBP, which is a very good thing. He's also 6th in the league in OPS, which I think some sabremetrics people claim is one of, if not the most important hitting stat. On the other hand, the sabremetrics people will tell you that RBI's is one of the most overrated stats since it depends on people being on base, and often in scoring position.

And on a final note, Votto is second in the league in runs scored. One reason is that he's getting on base so much.

chico
06-15-2013, 09:02 AM
Marty Brennaman's word is not gospel (but don't tell him that). Are you saying Marty knows better than Votto does? Because that's what it sounds like. I trust Votto knows what he's doing at the plate much more than I trust a guy who's sitting up in the booth. I'd rather have Votto on base than have him try to hit bad - or even marginal - pitches he knows he doesn't have a good chance of reaching safely on.

XU 87
06-15-2013, 09:13 AM
Brandon Phillips has 22 more RBI's than Votto. But Phillips has an OPS of .797. Votto has an OPS of .943.

I can't find a current stat, but as of May 25, Votto was hitting .385 this year with men in scoring position.

Juice
06-15-2013, 10:40 AM
Votto is a great hitter. You can reference stats, articles, whatever anyone wants. I never said he wasnt a great hitter. I simply want him to be more aggressive at the plate and look to drive in runs when given the opportunity. Does that mean he should swing at some marginal pitches when the counts in his favor ? IMHO, yes he should. He's that good. He's being overly selective in situations where the Reds need his bat.

You guys are dismissing Marty's opinion as well ? That's hilarious. He's watched more baseball than some of you have been alive. He's a Hall of Famer. Some of you guys are.......funny.

He may be a hall of famer but his understanding of baseball is old fashioned and needs to catch up with the information people now have access to. Believe it or not, Marty is wrong. Baseball announcers have some of the dumbest views on baseball. Hawk Harrelson? Moron. Harold Reynolds? Total tard. John Kruk? Idiot. I could go on.

Juice
06-15-2013, 10:41 AM
Brandon Phillips has 22 more RBI's than Votto. But Phillips has an OPS of .797. Votto has an OPS of .943.

I can't find a current stat, but as of May 25, Votto was hitting .385 this year with men in scoring position.

But RBIs?!?!?!

Porkopolis
06-15-2013, 10:41 AM
Brandon Phillips has 22 more RBI's than Votto. But Phillips has an OPS of .797. Votto has an OPS of .943.

I can't find a current stat, but as of May 25, Votto was hitting .385 this year with men in scoring position.

A lot of the folks praising BP's RBI numbers forget that he has them in large part because Votto and Choo are getting on base in front of him at a historical pace. I love Brandon but as even he admits RBI umbels don't tell much of the story.

bleedXblue
06-15-2013, 11:46 AM
He may be a hall of famer but his understanding of baseball is old fashioned and needs to catch up with the information people now have access to. Believe it or not, Marty is wrong. Baseball announcers have some of the dumbest views on baseball. Hawk Harrelson? Moron. Harold Reynolds? Total tard. John Kruk? Idiot. I could go on.

Marty is a legend and has an incredible amount of credibility within baseball. You dismissing his opinion is absolutely laughable.

bleedXblue
06-15-2013, 11:48 AM
Brandon Phillips has 22 more RBI's than Votto. But Phillips has an OPS of .797. Votto has an OPS of .943.

I can't find a current stat, but as of May 25, Votto was hitting .385 this year with men in scoring position.

How many walks has he taken with runners in scoring position ? I would love to see that stat.

Again, I don't think anyone is arguing whether or not Votto can hit.

XUFan09
06-15-2013, 11:57 AM
How many walks has he taken with runners in scoring position ? I would love to see that stat.

Again, I don't think anyone is arguing whether or not Votto can hit.

It wouldn't surprise me if Votto has a high walk rate with runners in scoring position, because pitchers end up throwing around him a decent amount of the time (if not straight-up intentionally walking him).

http://local.cincinnati.com/community/Story.aspx?c=100025&url=http://local.cincinnati.com/share/news/story.aspx?sid=193933

Runners in scoring position: BA .405 and OBP .526. That's a decent difference, but the difference between BA and OBP is practically identical with his overall of .319 and .439.

The real key is runners in scoring position with 2 outs: .400 and .667. Yep, he's definitely getting pitched around some of the time, so that the pitcher can face Phillips.

Juice
06-15-2013, 11:59 AM
Marty is a legend and has an incredible amount of credibility within baseball. You dismissing his opinion is absolutely laughable.

It's ok not to agree with Marty. You won't die. Plenty of people who work on TV and radio are wrong. Just because he has called games on the radio it doesn't make him right. And when it comes to Votto, you and Marty are wrong.

XU 87
06-15-2013, 12:26 PM
How many walks has he taken with runners in scoring position ? I would love to see that stat.

Again, I don't think anyone is arguing whether or not Votto can hit.

Walks are good. It gets people on base so they can score runs. Votto is second in the league in runs. If there is a guy on first, it moves the runner over. It also gets a starting pitcher's pitch count up. I think you should read Moneyball to understand where we're all coming from.

And I ask again. Do you want Votto to swing at bad pitches outside the strike zone and make outs instead of walking?

bleedXblue
06-15-2013, 01:05 PM
It's ok not to agree with Marty. You won't die. Plenty of people who work on TV and radio are wrong. Just because he has called games on the radio it doesn't make him right. And when it comes to Votto, you and Marty are wrong.

He's made millions with his baseball commentary and opinion. He's done it so well he's in the HOF. I'll go down swinging with the Hall off Famer instead of a few guys who are posting on a basketball message board who think they know more than one of the legends of the game. Ridiculous you are.

bleedXblue
06-15-2013, 01:06 PM
Walks are good. It gets people on base so they can score runs. Votto is second in the league in runs. If there is a guy on first, it moves the runner over. It also gets a starting pitcher's pitch count up. I think you should read Moneyball to understand where we're all coming from.

And I ask again. Do you want Votto to swing at bad pitches outside the strike zone and make outs instead of walking?

Please go back and read some of my previous posts. I never said he should swing at bad pitches.

Juice
06-15-2013, 03:00 PM
He's made millions with his baseball commentary and opinion. He's done it so well he's in the HOF. I'll go down swinging with the Hall off Famer instead of a few guys who are posting on a basketball message board who think they know more than one of the legends of the game. Ridiculous you are.

You do realize that people who write and talk about baseball for a living disagree with you and Marty. They have covered the same idiotic notion that you two believe that Votto walks too much. So yeah, keep blindly just believing that and feeling comfortable with it because "Marty believes it too!"

http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/05/24/joey-votto-and-the-generation-gap/

http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/05/18/joey-votto-reaches-base-six-times-as-reds-rout-phillies/

http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/19/joey-votto-is-not-struggling/

And since you're so hung up on the Hall of Fame bullshit, here is a post from Hal McCoy responding to Marty
http://www.daytondailynews.com/blogs/content/shared-gen/blogs/dayton/cincinnatireds/entries/2013/04/18/whats_wrong_with_votto_nothing.html/

http://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/2013/4/23/4254262/does-joey-votto-really-walk-too-much

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/joey-votto-on-hitting/

XU 87
06-15-2013, 05:04 PM
Please go back and read some of my previous posts. I never said he should swing at bad pitches.

But in order for him to not walk as much, he has to swing at bad pitches. That 3-2 ball that results in a walk? You want him to swing instead of taking it.

chico
06-15-2013, 07:46 PM
Does that mean he should swing at some marginal pitches when the counts in his favor ? IMHO, yes he should. He's that good. He's being overly selective in situations where the Reds need his bat.



Here's what you said - he should swing at more marginal pitches. That's swinging at pitches that aren't good. You can argue semantics and say you never said he shouldn't swing at bad pitches, but you want him to swing at pitches that aren't good.

bleedXblue
06-16-2013, 12:14 AM
Here's what you said - he should swing at more marginal pitches. That's swinging at pitches that aren't good. You can argue semantics and say you never said he shouldn't swing at bad pitches, but you want him to swing at pitches that aren't good.

Honestly, have you ever played baseball ? You really are going to go with this ? The difference between a ball and a strike can be millimeters. Yes, I want Votto to be more aggressive in situations where he can be and team needs him to be. He's an incredible talent......I just want him to assume the leadership role the Reds have given him and quit nitpicking every pitch he sees in hopes that he can draw another walk and leave the difficult work up to BP, JB and TF.

bleedXblue
06-16-2013, 12:24 AM
You do realize that people who write and talk about baseball for a living disagree with you and Marty. They have covered the same idiotic notion that you two believe that Votto walks too much. So yeah, keep blindly just believing that and feeling comfortable with it because "Marty believes it too!"

http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/05/24/joey-votto-and-the-generation-gap/

http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/05/18/joey-votto-reaches-base-six-times-as-reds-rout-phillies/

http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/19/joey-votto-is-not-struggling/

And since you're so hung up on the Hall of Fame bullshit, here is a post from Hal McCoy responding to Marty
http://www.daytondailynews.com/blogs/content/shared-gen/blogs/dayton/cincinnatireds/entries/2013/04/18/whats_wrong_with_votto_nothing.html/

http://www.beyondtheboxscore.com/2013/4/23/4254262/does-joey-votto-really-walk-too-much

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/joey-votto-on-hitting/

Swimming upstream dude.

The McCoy article doesn't challenge or address MB comments at all. Weak effort. Please try to do better.

Keep Googling all the articles you need to find to try and support your dung.

HOF against you're weak a** articles from Joe Nobody's continues to crack me up.

XU 87
06-16-2013, 10:53 AM
The difference between a ball and a strike can be millimeters. .

That is true, but so what? You're making the giant assumption that the "pitch just outside the strike zone" is a good pitch to hit. Often, the "pitch just inside the strike zone" is the toughest strike to hit. So the "pitch just outside the strike zone" is often even tougher to hit. It's the pitches well inside the strike zone that are often the best ones to hit.

XU 87
06-16-2013, 11:01 AM
A lot of the folks praising BP's RBI numbers forget that he has them in large part because Votto and Choo are getting on base in front of him at a historical pace. I love Brandon but as even he admits RBI numbers don't tell much of the story.

That was my point.

Votto has 22 less RBI's than Phillips, but Votto's OPS is much higher than Phillips'.

chico
06-16-2013, 11:59 AM
Honestly, have you ever played baseball ? You really are going to go with this ? The difference between a ball and a strike can be millimeters. Yes, I want Votto to be more aggressive in situations where he can be and team needs him to be. He's an incredible talent......I just want him to assume the leadership role the Reds have given him and quit nitpicking every pitch he sees in hopes that he can draw another walk and leave the difficult work up to BP, JB and TF.

The "played the game" argument? Well, if you must know, I have, and likely at a higher level than you did. But that's besides the point. I do, however, find it truly ironic that the guy who wants us all to follow Marty Brennaman lock, stock and barrel (and has Marty ever "played the game") now is asking if I ever played the game.

My goodness, these poor, poor hitters who can't tell the difference between a ball and a strike. Who can't tell the millimeters between a ball over the plate or one just outside, or just too low. How do they manage?

Are you really telling me that a guy like Votto has trouble distinguishing between a pitch he can handle and one he can't? Are you telling me guys like Tony Gwynn and Ted Williams couldn't tell balls from strikes? Votto's batting eye is just as good as Gwynn's or Williams' was, so I think Im going to let him do what he thinks best versus some guy who resorts to "have you played the game" argument. Because having played the game, I can understand that it's much better to swing at pitches you can handle and let the other ones go, than to try to make something happen by swinging at pitches you know are out of your hitting zone.

Now if Votto was taking a lot of strikes, you may have an argument. But I don't see that. I see a guy getting on base, and I have no problem with that at all. And you don't have to be someone who's "played the game" to see that.

XUFan09
06-16-2013, 12:25 PM
The "played the game" argument? Well, if you must know, I have, and likely at a higher level than you did. But that's besides the point. I do, however, find it truly ironic that the guy who wants us all to follow Marty Brennaman lock, stock and barrel (and has Marty ever "played the game") now is asking if I ever played the game.

My goodness, these poor, poor hitters who can't tell the difference between a ball and a strike. Who can't tell the millimeters between a ball over the plate or one just outside, or just too low. How do they manage?

Are you really telling me that a guy like Votto has trouble distinguishing between a pitch he can handle and one he can't? Are you telling me guys like Tony Gwynn and Ted Williams couldn't tell balls from strikes? Votto's batting eye is just as good as Gwynn's or Williams' was, so I think Im going to let him do what he thinks best versus some guy who resorts to "have you played the game" argument. Because having played the game, I can understand that it's much better to swing at pitches you can handle and let the other ones go, than to try to make something happen by swinging at pitches you know are out of your hitting zone.

Now if Votto was taking a lot of strikes, you may have an argument. But I don't see that. I see a guy getting on base, and I have no problem with that at all. And you don't have to be someone who's "played the game" to see that.

Pretty much that.

Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk 2

Juice
06-16-2013, 02:51 PM
Swimming upstream dude.

The McCoy article doesn't challenge or address MB comments at all. Weak effort. Please try to do better.

Keep Googling all the articles you need to find to try and support your dung.

HOF against you're weak a** articles from Joe Nobody's continues to crack me up.

Hal McCoy posted that a day after Marty's comments. So he didn't call him out directly, but it was in response.

And you do realize that Marty is just some guy who announces games? Sure he has seen a lot of them, but it's not like he has some skill that allows him to understand baseball better than anyone else.

And those Joe somebody's have a better understanding of baseball than Marty. Marty is a Hall of Famer because he is good at talking on a radio, not recognizing a hitter's skill or lack thereof.

Have you noticed that you and Marty are the only two people that think your position is the right one?

mohr5150
06-22-2013, 09:48 PM
And Chapman proves once again how he is, quite possibly, the most overrated pitcher in the history of Reds baseball. He throws the ball fast. That is it. He has no other pitch. And as anyone who knows anything about baseball, hitters will, sooner than later, be able to time a fastball, no matter how fast. Mike Leake proved tonight that there is so much more to pitching than throwing fast. He is a pitcher. Chapman is a thrower who knew he didn't have what it took to be a starter, so he cried until he got his way to be the closer again this year, the much safer choice for him and the easier choice. Like most relievers, Chapman sucks. If he was good, he'd be a starter.

XU 87
06-23-2013, 09:27 AM
I realize you wrote this right after the loss, and I was thinking similar thoughts, but when you look at his record, he's pretty good. He had 38 saves and 5 blown saves last year. This year he has 18 saves and 3 blown saves. I think that's pretty good, although not dominant. But one problem with Chapman is that when he blows a save, it seems he just falls apart and loses the game, as opposed to giving up one run for a tie game.

Last year, Chapman finished 9th in save percentage with pitchers with over 30 saves. This year he is 14th in save percentage with pitchers with over 15 saves. So I would say he's been a good, but not great, closer.

Juice
06-23-2013, 12:21 PM
And Chapman proves once again how he is, quite possibly, the most overrated pitcher in the history of Reds baseball. He throws the ball fast. That is it. He has no other pitch. And as anyone who knows anything about baseball, hitters will, sooner than later, be able to time a fastball, no matter how fast. Mike Leake proved tonight that there is so much more to pitching than throwing fast. He is a pitcher. Chapman is a thrower who knew he didn't have what it took to be a starter, so he cried until he got his way to be the closer again this year, the much safer choice for him and the easier choice. Like most relievers, Chapman sucks. If he was good, he'd be a starter.

Are you serious? I honestly have no idea if you are just trolling or you legitimately believe this because all of that is nonsense. I am going to assume you are being serious and ask you to look at his FIP, xFIP, and his K/9 numbers for this year and last. http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=10233&position=P

XU 87
06-23-2013, 01:13 PM
Are you serious? I honestly have no idea if you are just trolling or you legitimately believe this because all of that is nonsense. I am going to assume you are being serious and ask you to look at his FIP, xFIP, and his K/9 numbers for this year and last. http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=10233&position=P

I'm curious. Would you argue that those numbers show he's one of the best closers? Because I would think the save ratio would be the best standard. But I realize that a save ratio has some limitations such as how many 1 run leads did he save as opposed to three run leads.

Juice
06-23-2013, 01:22 PM
I'm curious. Would you argue that those numbers show he's one of the best closers? Because I would think the save ratio would be the best standard. But I realize that a save ratio has some limitations such as how many 1 run leads did he save as opposed to three run leads.

I hate looking at only closers because I think many teams misuse their closer and/or have the wrong person in the role based on BS like "experience as a closer" when there are plenty of younger/better relievers on the roster. Looking at all relievers' WAR, Chapman is 15th right now. http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=rel&lg=all&qual=y&type=8&season=2013&month=0&season1=2013&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0
The thing to remember is that relievers numbers can be a little more volatile from year to year, but I would still take Chapman over pretty much any reliever not named Rivera. Rosenthal and Reed are two pretty impressive young relievers, as is Kimbrel.

Xavgrad08
06-23-2013, 02:07 PM
The Reds this year have blown 8 leads from the 7th inning on through 76 games. It's going to be tough to win the division if that continues. Hopefully, we can get Marshall back healthy.

Fireball
06-23-2013, 03:05 PM
Chapman just has those days where he just completely doesn't have it. You could tell after the second batter he faced that it was one of those days. Hell, Dusty could tell. He went out there with a 1-0 could to talk to him.

Dusty should have have someone warming in the pen to come in after Chapman walked the bases loaded.

mohr5150
06-23-2013, 07:31 PM
The only pitcher I can think of that had regular success with only one pitch was Rivera. His situation is different because the cutter moves like crazy, unlike Chapman's fastball. After getting over the fear of the 100 mph, hitters are beginning to time his fastball. He has nothing else that he can throw consistently. Plus he seems to have a major attitude problem. I don't like him. You can flash all the stats you want, unless he develops a better slider or another pitch, he's going to continue battling inconsistencies. I'll be honest, though, there haven't been many relievers I have liked.

XU 87
06-23-2013, 09:27 PM
The only pitcher I can think of that had regular success with only one pitch was Rivera. His situation is different because the cutter moves like crazy, unlike Chapman's fastball. After getting over the fear of the 100 mph, hitters are beginning to time his fastball. He has nothing else that he can throw consistently.

He throws a slider from time to time. But you can't doubt that he's had a lot of success. The times that he struggles is usually because he's having control problems. When he's locating his pitches, he's pretty damn tough to hit.

Juice
06-23-2013, 09:40 PM
The only pitcher I can think of that had regular success with only one pitch was Rivera. His situation is different because the cutter moves like crazy, unlike Chapman's fastball. After getting over the fear of the 100 mph, hitters are beginning to time his fastball. He has nothing else that he can throw consistently. Plus he seems to have a major attitude problem. I don't like him. You can flash all the stats you want, unless he develops a better slider or another pitch, he's going to continue battling inconsistencies. I'll be honest, though, there haven't been many relievers I have liked.

What is that attitude thing even based on?

And those crazy stats, besides showing the true value and measurement of a player, I am just going to say that I think he sucks.

bleedXblue
06-26-2013, 04:53 PM
Reds are playing some lackluster baseball. With their MVP out for the series it will be interesting to see how the rest if the team responds.

Need some guys to step up and carry their weight. I don't see it happening.

On a side note, how many games this year has Votto knocked in more than 2 RBI's or hit more than 1 home run ?

You got it........ Doughnut.

Reds need leaders and guys that want to carry the load. I see only two guys on the roster who want the spotlight and relish being in pressure situations with something to prove: Phillips and the emerging Jay Bruce.

gladdenguy
06-26-2013, 07:19 PM
When you look at the grand scheme of things the Cardinals and Pirates are better teams.
The Reds bullpen and lineup both suck. Throw in one of the worst situational managers and they are average. If the starting pitching isn't dominant they won't continue to win games.

XU 87
06-26-2013, 08:42 PM
When you look at the grand scheme of things the Cardinals and Pirates are better teams.
The Reds bullpen and lineup both suck. Throw in one of the worst situational managers and they are average. If the starting pitching isn't dominant they won't continue to win games.

The Reds have the 6th best record in baseball, and this is coming off a bad road trip. They would be winning two other divisions and would be about a game out of two more.

mohr5150
06-26-2013, 09:08 PM
I don't believe the Reds are a very good team. Let's just look at the team:

They have very good first and second basemen and an above average right fielder. Their catching combo is one of the worst offensively in the major leagues. Their shortstop is horrible, and their third baseman is below average. Their right field combo is well below average, and their center fielder, while having a very solid first month has tanked it the next two. You aren't a good team when only three of your eight starting positions are filled with above average players. Now look at their starting rotation. Cueto has been hurt, Latos has been very solid, Arroyo has been average, Leake has been a pleasant surprise, and Homer has been a bitter disappointment. Their bullpen is a shell of what it was last year, topped off with several injuries and the most overrated closer in the game. This team has beat up on the Cubs, the Brewers, the Marlins, and the Mets while getting bitch slapped by teams above .500. I am sorry to say but I believe by the All-Star Break they will be hovering around .500. I overvalued several players on this team, as did many of the experts. I'm pissed off as hell about the lack of development in this team, and the minor leagues have been obliterated somehow. Maybe Choo turns it around, we see better performances out of Hannigan and Frazier during the second half, and Homer finally figures out how to stop being a head case on the mound, but I still don't see us going very far if we make it to the playoffs. And I predicted this team would go to the World Series!

bleedXblue
06-26-2013, 09:25 PM
I don't believe the Reds are a very good team. Let's just look at the team:

They have very good first and second basemen and an above average right fielder. Their catching combo is one of the worst offensively in the major leagues. Their shortstop is horrible, and their third baseman is below average. Their right field combo is well below average, and their center fielder, while having a very solid first month has tanked it the next two. You aren't a good team when only three of your eight starting positions are filled with above average players. Now look at their starting rotation. Cueto has been hurt, Latos has been very solid, Arroyo has been average, Leake has been a pleasant surprise, and Homer has been a bitter disappointment. Their bullpen is a shell of what it was last year, topped off with several injuries and the most overrated closer in the game. This team has beat up on the Cubs, the Brewers, the Marlins, and the Mets while getting bitch slapped by teams above .500. I am sorry to say but I believe by the All-Star Break they will be hovering around .500. I overvalued several players on this team, as did many of the experts. I'm pissed off as hell about the lack of development in this team, and the minor leagues have been obliterated somehow. Maybe Choo turns it around, we see better performances out of Hannigan and Frazier during the second half, and Homer finally figures out how to stop being a head case on the mound, but I still don't see us going very far if we make it to the playoffs. And I predicted this team would go to the World Series!

I think the Reds have enough talent and solid starting pitching to hang in there for the majority of the year. Yes, they're on a bad stretch and better win 2 of 3 in Texas or they could find themselves 5-6 games out of first. The starting pitching has been very solid and I don't think that will change. It's getting Choo, Votto and Fraiser going thats going to propel them into the playoff's. I think Phillips will be the same as he always is......solid and clutch. Bruce has been very solid and having the most consistent year of his career.

Juice
06-26-2013, 10:06 PM
I think the Reds have enough talent and solid starting pitching to hang in there for the majority of the year. Yes, they're on a bad stretch and better win 2 of 3 in Texas or they could find themselves 5-6 games out of first. The starting pitching has been very solid and I don't think that will change. It's getting Choo, Votto and Fraiser going thats going to propel them into the playoff's. I think Phillips will be the same as he always is......solid and clutch. Bruce has been very solid and having the most consistent year of his career.

Why does everyone act like Phillips is some great hitter? His OPS is .741 and his OPS+ is 98 (an OPS+ of 100 is average). He's great defensively but an average hitter.

Masterofreality
06-27-2013, 06:41 AM
Choo is being Choo.

Average now down to .269. We saw this in Cleveland for years. Burns like a superstar for a time then fades. Michael Bourn is a vast improvement.

Like I said on another thread in April. When you get to August, everyone will be wondering where the Choo of April went.

XU 87
06-27-2013, 07:32 AM
Choo can't hit left handed pitching. Last stat I saw a few weeks ago showed he was hitting around .175 against lefties, and that number may be a bit high. I think they should consider platooning him with Heisey.

P.S. I need to reconsider what I wrote above because average is somewhat meaningless for a leadoff hitter. It's all about OBP. So if his OBP is still decent against lefties, then don't consider platooning.

Fireball
06-27-2013, 08:02 AM
Why does everyone act like Phillips is some great hitter? His OPS is .741 and his OPS+ is 98 (an OPS+ of 100 is average). He's great defensively but an average hitter.

Phillips is not a great hitter, but is a very good hitter for a second baseman. I'll certainly take the production we get out of him.

The Reds will be fine. The lineup is not a powerhouse, but is solid. If Frazier and the catching Tandem hit more like they did last year, then this lineup goes from OK to very good. The bullpen will be much better when Marshall and Broxton come of the DL. This team is built to win with pitching, and that's what will keep them in contention and probably into the playoffs.

If they want complete for a World Series, they'd better hope that Ludwick comes back on fire or pick up a bat at the deadline.

Masterofreality
06-27-2013, 08:10 AM
Although I love Jason Kipnis, I'd take Brandon Phillips back in a NY minute.

He got a raw deal by the ridiculous Eric Wedge up here in Cleve.

Juice
06-27-2013, 11:11 AM
Phillips is not a great hitter, but is a very good hitter for a second baseman. I'll certainly take the production we get out of him.

The Reds will be fine. The lineup is not a powerhouse, but is solid. If Frazier and the catching Tandem hit more like they did last year, then this lineup goes from OK to very good. The bullpen will be much better when Marshall and Broxton come of the DL. This team is built to win with pitching, and that's what will keep them in contention and probably into the playoffs.

If they want complete for a World Series, they'd better hope that Ludwick comes back on fire or pick up a bat at the deadline.

the OPS+ of 98 indicates he's an average hitter for his position. OPS+ takes into account things like ballpark and position. His career OPS+ is 97. He's an average hitter for his position, which is fine because he's a great defensive player.

XUFan09
06-27-2013, 12:01 PM
Why does everyone act like Phillips is some great hitter? His OPS is .741 and his OPS+ is 98 (an OPS+ of 100 is average). He's great defensively but an average hitter.

But...but...RBIs! Getting those shows he has leadership...right?

Juice
06-27-2013, 01:35 PM
But...but...RBIs! Getting those shows he has leadership...right?

But he's not a clubhouse leader like Rolen because he doesn't sprint to first on every ground ball!

bleedXblue
06-27-2013, 05:46 PM
But...but...RBIs! Getting those shows he has leadership...right?

No it simply shows he can deliver when needed.

He's a career .270, 22 hr, 85 RBI guy .... And he does it every damn year. Show me another 2nd basemen over the last 7-8 years that's done what he has and delivered the gold gloves.

bleedXblue
06-27-2013, 05:47 PM
the OPS+ of 98 indicates he's an average hitter for his position. OPS+ takes into account things like ballpark and position. His career OPS+ is 97. He's an average hitter for his position, which is fine because he's a great defensive player.

He is not an average hitter for his position. Show me 10 other 2nd basemen with the stats Phillips has delivered every year for the last 7-8 years.

SixFig
06-27-2013, 06:55 PM
He is not an average hitter for his position. Show me 10 other 2nd basemen with the stats Phillips has delivered every year for the last 7-8 years.

Other than Cano...no one. Not in the post-mainstream-steroids era

Juice
06-27-2013, 07:12 PM
He is not an average hitter for his position. Show me 10 other 2nd basemen with the stats Phillips has delivered every year for the last 7-8 years.

Did you not read my other posts? His OPS+ is 97, an OPS+ of 100 is average. His is average, or slightly below. Sorry that you look at average and counting stats, which are outdated, and do not tell the whole story about a hitter.

Juice
06-27-2013, 07:20 PM
Other than Cano...no one. Not in the post-mainstream-steroids era

Pedroia? Utley? Zobrist? Kinsler? Rickie Weeks (for some seasons)?

XUFan09
06-27-2013, 07:44 PM
No it simply shows he can deliver when needed.

He's a career .270, 22 hr, 85 RBI guy .... And he does it every damn year. Show me another 2nd basemen over the last 7-8 years that's done what he has and delivered the gold gloves.

So you're putting a lot of value in his ability to deliver when needed. Okay, I can work with that. So you're talking about how he has .397 average with a runner on first or a .405 average with a runner in scoring position. If the bases are loaded, that jumps to .500. Wow, that's pretty damn impressive.

Oh wait...Those are Votto's stats, not Philips'. My bad. I guess he's good at delivering when needed too.

bleedXblue
06-27-2013, 07:58 PM
Pedroia? Utley? Zobrist? Kinsler? Rickie Weeks (for some seasons)?

Utely has been trending downward for 3+ years. Weeks ? Really ?

You're clueless if you think Phillips is average. Absolutely clueless.

He's the glue that keeps this team together. He gets more clutch hits than anyone else. He's a gamer.

Why don't watch a game or two instead of referencing ops all day long. Stats only tell part of the story.

bleedXblue
06-27-2013, 08:04 PM
So you're putting a lot of value in his ability to deliver when needed. Okay, I can work with that. So you're talking about how he has .397 average with a runner on first or a .405 average with a runner in scoring position. If the bases are loaded, that jumps to .500. Wow, that's pretty damn impressive.

Oh wait...Those are Votto's stats, not Philips'. My bad. I guess he's good at delivering when needed too.

Yes, that's why I'd like for him to get the bat off his shoulder more. He's too damn good to nit pick every at bat.

I'd rather have him be more aggressive and swing at some marginal pitches than leave it up to The guys behind him. He's flat out a great hitter. I've never argued that he wasn't ?

Juice
06-27-2013, 08:06 PM
Utely has been trending downward for 3+ years. Weeks ? Really ?

You're clueless if you think Phillips is average. Absolutely clueless.

He's the glue that keeps this team together. He gets more clutch hits than anyone else. He's a gamer.

Why don't watch a game or two instead of referencing ops all day long. Stats only tell part of the story.

Sigh. I said he was an average HITTER. Utley is still a better hitter than him. Weeks is more peaks and valleys but has been a better hitter. And you just reference vague bullshit like "clutch," "glue," gamer." I reference OPS+ which takes into account, on base %, slugging %, ball park factors, position, etc. Sorry that I like to use hard numbers that are quantifiable and not some bullshit that cannot be measured. "Oh yeah, he's a gamer. He tries really hard. He's the glue that holds things together." Yeah, because that is what GMs base contracts on. I bet you're a Michael Young fan too, and think Justin Upton doesn't try hard. Your baseball arguments are ancient and based on nothing.

I will also add that OPS+ isn't perfect. There are better stats out there. It's just really easy to understand for people who like to remain in the dark.

XUFan09
06-27-2013, 08:26 PM
Yes, that's why I'd like for him to get the bat off his shoulder more. He's too damn good to nit pick every at bat.

I'd rather have him be more aggressive and swing at some marginal pitches than leave it up to The guys behind him. He's flat out a great hitter. I've never argued that he wasn't ?

He's already a very effective hitter when runners are on. Why should he go after those marginal pitches when the bases are empty? The long term probability of scoring is often higher if he walks to set up Phillips or Bruce driving him in than if he takes risks on pitches that aren't that good.

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Charlesbt4
06-27-2013, 08:45 PM
Sigh. I said he was an average HITTER. Utley is still a better hitter than him. Weeks is more peaks and valleys but has been a better hitter. And you just reference vague bullshit like "clutch," "glue," gamer." I reference OPS+ which takes into account, on base %, slugging %, ball park factors, position, etc. Sorry that I like to use hard numbers that are quantifiable and not some bullshit that cannot be measured. "Oh yeah, he's a gamer. He tries really hard. He's the glue that holds things together." Yeah, because that is what GMs base contracts on. I bet you're a Michael Young fan too, and think Justin Upton doesn't try hard. Your baseball arguments are ancient and based on nothing.

I will also add that OPS+ isn't perfect. There are better stats out there. It's just really easy to understand for people who like to remain in the dark.

The moment you listed Rickie Weeks, a player with a career .250 batting average, as a better hitter than Brandon Phillips, is the precise time at which all prior and future arguments you make should be disregarded. That's absurd. You're better than that.

Robinson Cano and Brandon Phillips are far and away the best overall second basemen in the major leagues. Chase Utley, by the way, is dogshit both defensively and offensively, and has been for the past three seasons.

Charlesbt4
06-27-2013, 08:46 PM
He's already a very effective hitter when runners are on. Why should he go after those marginal pitches when the bases are empty? The long term probability of scoring is often higher if he walks to set up Phillips or Bruce driving him in than if he takes risks on pitches that aren't that good.

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People that argue that because Votto is a great hitter, he should be less selective, fail to realize that he is a great hitter, in part, because he is so selective.

XUFan09
06-27-2013, 09:03 PM
People that argue that because Votto is a great hitter, he should be less selective, fail to realize that he is a great hitter, in part, because he is so selective.

Yup.

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Juice
06-27-2013, 09:04 PM
The moment you listed Rickie Weeks, a player with a career .250 batting average, as a better hitter than Brandon Phillips, is the precise time at which all prior and future arguments you make should be disregarded. That's absurd. You're better than that.

Robinson Cano and Brandon Phillips are far and away the best overall second basemen in the major leagues. Chase Utley, by the way, is dogshit both defensively and offensively, and has been for the past three seasons.

I said for some seasons and that he has more peaks and valleys. Look at his stats for 2007, 2009, 2010, 2011. Weeks has 3 seasons that are better than Phillips' best season. And please don't cite batting average. You're better than that.

And Utley has declined but he's 34. That happens after you turn 30. And his OPS is 50 points higher the last two years (with a smaller sample size because of injury) than Phillips is having this year. This season Utley has higher average, OBP, and slugging. He has 3 less HRs,

Charlesbt4
06-27-2013, 09:16 PM
I said for some seasons and that he has more peaks and valleys. Look at his stats for 2007, 2009, 2010, 2011. Weeks has 3 seasons that are better than Phillips' best season. And please don't cite batting average. You're better than that.

And Utley has declined but he's 34. That happens after you turn 30. And his OPS is 50 points higher the last two years (with a smaller sample size because of injury) than Phillips is having this year. This season Utley has higher average, OBP, and slugging. He has 3 less HRs,

Please, get over the talk of Rickie Weeks being or having ever been a better player or hitter than Brandon Phillips. In his best season, he hit .269, drove in 112, had 29 homeruns, and 83 rbi. In literally every other season, he has struggled to play anything close to a complete season, with absolutely pedestrian numbers.

As for Utley, he's on pace to play all of 103 games this season. If you want to take his bat over Phillips', that's your business.

Juice
06-27-2013, 09:23 PM
Please, get over the talk of Rickie Weeks being or having ever been a better player or hitter than Brandon Phillips. In his best season, he hit .269, drove in 112, had 29 homeruns, and 83 rbi. In literally every other season, he has struggled to play anything close to a complete season, with absolutely pedestrian numbers.

As for Utley, he's on pace to play all of 103 games this season. If you want to take his bat over Phillips', that's your business.

Why does everyone keep citing BA and counting stats? They're antiquated and give a partial story. Weeks gets on base at a higher clip than Phillips. Phillips OBP is dependent on contact. He can't take a walk. And again, Weeks had three seasons of higher OPS's than BP's best season of OPS. It's true, I swear, you can look it up.

I wouldn't take either Weeks or Utley over BP. Weeks is inconsistent. Utley is old and injury prone the last two seasons. BP is a better fielder than both. But again, I am talking about BP's bat. As a hitter, he is completely overrated in this city because people actually read/believe what Daugherty says. They simply look at batting average and draw conclusions.